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  1. #61
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam View Post
    Totally agree. I'd easily put The Return of Wally West among my list of favorite Wally West and Teen Titans stories. Though I doubt many would do the same. Granted, both are pretty long lists, but still. Hopefully, with evil Donna arc over with, Abnett's going to return to the stronger writing of the pre-Lazarus Contract issues.
    I agree here as well. Before Lazarus contract Titans was my fav ongoing book. But the crossover made me don't like it... I'm happy that Abnett is going back to his good writing again. And I hope he will less focus on Wally and let the other characters shine. Wich is happening with Donna actually.

    I just hope this arc in the February Solicitation isn't the end of the books.

    And I hope if Lian is really coming that it will not change the fact that Roy want to be with Donna. I think they relationship will evolve during the actual arc. We can see both of the characters (even the evil Donna) care for each other. I wanted for that since too long and the pre Flashpoint continuity was so great with them (except somes times were it was weird like they love each other but don't get together for X reasons).

    I want to see them more that they was in the precedent continuity without that stupid premonition. (and I don't want to see Terry again but that's an other thing lmao)

  2. #62
    long time member Herowatcher's Avatar
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    "History of the DC Universe" by Wolfman and Perez, when the DCU use to make sense.

  3. #63
    Ultimate Member Assam's Avatar
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    "Don't you have someone to go home to?" followed by him calling Jade. Just keep on foreshadowing her return, DC. I've waited a long time already.

    It'd be really neat if on top of Vertigo, Roy's mind was being influenced by the zap Wally gave him and that line was his subconscious trying to remind him of Lian.
    Current Top 20 Titles: New Super-Man and the Justice League of China/Runaways/Go Go Power Rangers/Mighty Morphin Power Rangers/Doom Patrol/Maxwell's Demons/Exit Stage Left: The Snagglepuss Chronicles/Paper Girls/All-New Wolverine/Unbeatable Squirrel Girl/Mech Cadet Yu/Quantum and Woody/Fence/Domino/X-Men Red/Ms. Marvel/Falcon/]The Wildstorm: Michael Cray/New Mutants: Dead Souls/Champions

  4. #64
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    4099989-batman-plus-arsenal-34.jpg

    I wish Percy did an Arsenal mini or even a back up for his Green Arrow run because I'm pretty sure he would have bought Lian back. He really respects history.
    My Pulls: Michael Cray, Green Arrow, Justice League, Justice League of America, New Super-Man, Titans, Cyber Force, Moon Knight, Falcon, Spider-Man, Black Hammer, Doctor Star, The Flash, The Terrifics,


    Saying "X don't sell" is one of the things that constantly hold back the comics industry. Maybe "X" didn't sell that one time, but will sell another time if done better or more in tune with contemporary readers.-Tony Isabella

  5. #65
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    As much as I want Lian back, it seems that it's not in DC plan to make her appear now, even if a lot of people assume that she was made in Titans not that long ago.

    And even if I loved the Return of Roy Harper arc from Percy, I hate that he ignored the Titans run and that the Titans run ignored (sort of) the GA run. Even if I'm not a huge fan of the issue since Lazarus Contract well as I've told like everywhere, I'm happy that they got the relationship between Roy and Donna back (even if the love triangle they have created it just for the drama of the traitor, well at least they should have used Cheshire if they wanted angst between Roy and Donna not Wally).

    With that being said like I said on the Donna Troy Appreciation post, I really hope the fact that they aren't in the same book anymore post No Justice will not make them break up (even if technically they just only acknowledge they love for each other but never started being with each other).

    And I just hope they'll drop the Cheshire/Arsenal, they love each other for 30 sec then hate each other like they did in preflashpoint (at least there that was mainly because of Lian), I always disliked that because every time he tried something with someone else she was often the cause of the break up, I mean even if I disliked his relationship with Kendra (mainly because I don't like Kendra lmao) she was the cause of their break up. For Donna that was more complicated but before the retcon of the prophetie (which actually explain a lot of thing when you think about it lmao) I always thought Chesh was part of the reason.

    I just hope in this continuity, Roy has learn that Chesh is the worst and that he should stay away from her as far as he can even if Lian come back in his life.

    I also hope that the Benson sister will write the character well, they told that he will be one of the first character they'll wrote through the Green Arrow Annual who tie with No Justice. And I hope they won't ignore the Abnett run and the relationship with Donna. Same for Abnett even if a lot of people don't like his writing and his run, I hope he will appear in the Titans book as a supportive character for Donna. By that I mean, their relationship as been the only plotline for him and the only positive one for her through the all book. So I really really hope they'll keep see each other even if they aren't in the same book.

    With that being said, I hope Abnett didn't teased us them being back together just to drop it because of the change of roster.


    And I hope he will get a lot of stories with him in it. He is one of the main reason, I read DC's comic books.

    (sorry for the bad English if there is any mistake...)
    Favorite characters:
    5 DC- Roy Harper, Donna Troy, Helena Bertinelli, Dinah Laurel Lance and Big Barda
    5 Marvel- Jean Grey, Richard Rider, Natasha Romanoff, Clint Barton and Angelica Jones

    Pull List:
    X-Men Red, X-Men Blue, Rogue&Gambit, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye, Marvel Two-in-One, Aquaman, Mister Miracle, Titans (Donna and Roy), Flash, Mera Queen of Atlantis, The Terrifics and some more.

  6. #66
    Ultimate Member Assam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dethi View Post
    As much as I want Lian back, it seems that it's not in DC plan to make her appear now, even if a lot of people assume that she was made in Titans not that long ago.
    I really did think that's where this current arc was going to go, but nope, just another in a long line of disappointments which has killed my interest in the GA and Titans franchises (and the DCU in general.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dethi View Post
    With that being said like I said on the Donna Troy Appreciation post, I really hope the fact that they aren't in the same book anymore post No Justice will not make them break up (even if technically they just only acknowledge they love for each other but never started being with each other).

    And I just hope they'll drop the Cheshire/Arsenal, they love each other for 30 sec then hate each other like they did in preflashpoint (at least there that was mainly because of Lian), I always disliked that because every time he tried something with someone else she was often the cause of the break up, I mean even if I disliked his relationship with Kendra (mainly because I don't like Kendra lmao) she was the cause of their break up. For Donna that was more complicated but before the retcon of the prophetie (which actually explain a lot of thing when you think about it lmao) I always thought Chesh was part of the reason.

    I just hope in this continuity, Roy has learn that Chesh is the worst and that he should stay away from her as far as he can even if Lian come back in his life.
    Agreed with most of this. Faerber's run really should have been the end of that relationship permanently.

    Also, while I'm primarily on team Roy/Donna, I also did like Roy/Kendra.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dethi View Post
    And I hope he will get a lot of stories with him in it. He is one of the main reason, I read DC's comic books.
    I won't be reading it either way. Like I said above, my interest in the DCU dies more by the day and, like with many properties, my mentality is currently that the real Roy and Lian got their happy ending, in Convergence, and that everything since 2011 is no different from a really crap TV adaptation.
    Current Top 20 Titles: New Super-Man and the Justice League of China/Runaways/Go Go Power Rangers/Mighty Morphin Power Rangers/Doom Patrol/Maxwell's Demons/Exit Stage Left: The Snagglepuss Chronicles/Paper Girls/All-New Wolverine/Unbeatable Squirrel Girl/Mech Cadet Yu/Quantum and Woody/Fence/Domino/X-Men Red/Ms. Marvel/Falcon/]The Wildstorm: Michael Cray/New Mutants: Dead Souls/Champions

  7. #67
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Assam View Post
    I won't be reading it either way. Like I said above, my interest in the DCU dies more by the day and, like with many properties, my mentality is currently that the real Roy and Lian got their happy ending, in Convergence, and that everything since 2011 is no different from a really crap TV adaptation.
    Is this some shade at the Arrowverse ?

  8. #68
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    The only time Roy and Jade made sense was in YJ where she was nowhere near the monster her comic counterpart became. There are a lot of unfortunate implications in the way Jade is written that belong in another argument.

    As for Donna and Roy, I kind of feel this was one of those things that work best as a childhood crush. Having it be an adult relationship doesn't really give it a mature feel and the Titans have a reputation as being incestuous and stagnated in growth as is.

    It's a shame Lian may not be back but frankly they should focus on fixing Roy first.

  9. #69
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    Sorry for that huge text, when it comes to something I love, I usually write a lot... (and sry if there is a lot of mistake, I'm not an English native speaker...)

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    The only time Roy and Jade made sense was in YJ where she was nowhere near the monster her comic counterpart became. There are a lot of unfortunate implications in the way Jade is written that belong in another argument.
    Well yeah I agree here, plus for once she wanted him to be a good man for her daughter and wanted to raiser her with him unlike in the comics when she just gave him and vanished to become the biggest terrorist ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    As for Donna and Roy, I kind of feel this was one of those things that work best as a childhood crush. Having it be an adult relationship doesn't really give it a mature feel and the Titans have a reputation as being incestuous and stagnated in growth as is.
    I don't see how them being a thing as adult is not mature. To explain myself I'll use all the run (including the last Titans run with the retcon of their first break up). They were in love when they were like 12/13 yo, after some years where we didn't saw a lot of their relationship due to the fact that it wasn't the theme of the book at that time, it was more action and funny moment and less chara dev and relationship stories but through all the run that came after (like really after not NTT), we learn that their relationship is more than just two teenagers having a crush on each other, they actually loved each other as hell. He asked her to marry him and she wanted to (but the prophety appeared and to save him she had to refuse), they broke up over this, the TT stopped being a thing and Roy started drugs because of all of this.

    After the drugs event, Roy as grow up from this experience and has showed from a flashback that he still loved her a lot even if they couldn't be together, he told it himself to Wally that she deserved better etc.. (and she got Terry sad fate here...).

    They both go past that, she got married (with the asshole and sorry but I hate this character so much) got a son when Roy got Lian and become a father from that they both grow as responsable adult, etc... And I think it's showed way more on Roy who was know for being pretty irresponsible ect...

    Years after (don't really know how the year works in the DC continuity), Donna divorce from Terry, lose the custody of her child, then lost them both in the car accident. Through what she said (in the Grayson run I think) it was thanks to Roy and Lian that she has been able to move on from that.

    With all, the thing we got thanks to the prediction the second time they broke up make a lot sense than the first time I read it. I mean, Roy loved her so much through the entire run, Lian was looking for her as the mother she never had (Hello Jade) and Donna loved them both so much too but they broke up in my opinion with the excuse of Donna wanting to become a bad girl by dating Roy again (because of Wally), after that she died from Graduation day (erk). In the funeral of Donna, when Roy and Lian talk about her, Lian literally calling Donna the heart of Roy and even if Roy counter argument telling her that she is his heart, which of course is true, I pretty sure her daughter got him pretty right. I mean he wanted that Donna "became" the mother of Lian, when you want someone to be the mother of your child that's mean something..

    Then the return of Donna Troy with Roy (and a little Lian) is like super important in the story and it show how much they love each other even after their broke up before her death.

    And then Cry For Justice, the run of Titans of 2008 and Rise of Arsenal, Donna almost killed Prometeus for hurting Roy and killed Lian, she said herself that if Oliver didn't had find him and killed him, she would have done it herself, in the Titans run, she was with Dinah (who consider Roy like her son) the most caring of Roy when he was in coma and was the most hurt from his condition (I never read an issue of a comics than this one, yeah I love suffer but it was super well written with the context even if I didn't liked it).

    And then Rise of Arsenal, where Donna was the last of his friend to try to save him from the "new" Titans' influence and Jade's.

    With all that I never felt that it needed to be only a teen crush. We got a lot of good story from that and even in the bad ones, the part between them were good (the most compelling) or at least the best part of the books in my opinion (for Rise of Arsenal at least). And I don't see where the incestuous relationship is about for them ?

    And in the current continuity, they've never been together prior to the current run even if it was clear that Roy loved her since a long time but since they forgit about each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    It's a shame Lian may not be back but frankly they should focus on fixing Roy first.
    Yes, I think they need to fix most of Roy first but, he is not the main Titans characters to fix right now in my opinion.
    Last edited by Dethi; 04-16-2018 at 11:35 PM.
    Favorite characters:
    5 DC- Roy Harper, Donna Troy, Helena Bertinelli, Dinah Laurel Lance and Big Barda
    5 Marvel- Jean Grey, Richard Rider, Natasha Romanoff, Clint Barton and Angelica Jones

    Pull List:
    X-Men Red, X-Men Blue, Rogue&Gambit, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye, Marvel Two-in-One, Aquaman, Mister Miracle, Titans (Donna and Roy), Flash, Mera Queen of Atlantis, The Terrifics and some more.

  10. #70
    Incredible Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    I just wanted to pop in and say Young Justice Arsenal was my favorite take on the character thus far. I would absolutely love if the next DC reboot somehow merged that version/story into the DCU proper.






  11. #71
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    I really hope they let his hear grow at one point in the show.

    And I'm not sure I want a clone of Roy running everywhere... I'm not a huge fan of clones and beside that Arsenal don't have that much story in Young Justice...
    Last edited by Dethi; 04-16-2018 at 11:35 PM.
    Favorite characters:
    5 DC- Roy Harper, Donna Troy, Helena Bertinelli, Dinah Laurel Lance and Big Barda
    5 Marvel- Jean Grey, Richard Rider, Natasha Romanoff, Clint Barton and Angelica Jones

    Pull List:
    X-Men Red, X-Men Blue, Rogue&Gambit, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye, Marvel Two-in-One, Aquaman, Mister Miracle, Titans (Donna and Roy), Flash, Mera Queen of Atlantis, The Terrifics and some more.

  12. #72
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    Roy is appearing in the preview of Nightwing#43: http://www.comicsbeat.com/exclusive-...lix-and-chill/

    Moreci seems to pretty much ignoring Titans or the issue take place before the current arc.
    Favorite characters:
    5 DC- Roy Harper, Donna Troy, Helena Bertinelli, Dinah Laurel Lance and Big Barda
    5 Marvel- Jean Grey, Richard Rider, Natasha Romanoff, Clint Barton and Angelica Jones

    Pull List:
    X-Men Red, X-Men Blue, Rogue&Gambit, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye, Marvel Two-in-One, Aquaman, Mister Miracle, Titans (Donna and Roy), Flash, Mera Queen of Atlantis, The Terrifics and some more.

  13. #73
    Incredible Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dethi View Post
    I really hope they let his hear grow at one point in the show.

    And I'm not sure I want a clone of Roy running everywhere... I'm not a huge fan of clones and beside that Arsenal don't have that much story in Young Justice...
    I like his hair short actually, but I don’t think it will make or break the character at all.

    Also, his story in Young Justice has the most potential out of most of the kids. Having two Roys in universe allows for their to be a more depth look of both sides of the character. Arsenal in particular has loads of potential of a writer tackling PTSD, abandonment syndroms, and mutiple of issues of loosing a limb.

    To top it off he has that sick robot arm that is way cooler then how it was potrayed in comics. I personally hope Arsenal plays a large role in the next season of YJ and I hope that version of him can make his way into the comics some how.

  14. #74
    Incredible Member Dethi's Avatar
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    About the last issue of Nightwing, where Roy appear into.

    spoilers:
    Well obviously that issue take place way before the current arc of Titans (or that the author totally ignored it but in my canon it will be before lmao) since Roy and Dick can talk to each other without being stupid (Hi Dick) or fighting your best friends to make them listen to you (hello Roy).

    At least overall the issue was really good. I really hope they could stop using Chesh every time Roy is around, she is the worst and he should be the one who knows about it (hello the last arc Green Arrow, Roy appeared in and the current Titans arc...), I just hope we will get Lian and then no more Arsenal and Chesh. But I probably expect to much we got that since years even before Flashpoint, never stopped when it should have ended a long time ago.


    update: It's written in the issue that it take place before Nightwing 34 so my bad but it donc change what I think.
    end of spoilers
    Last edited by Dethi; 04-18-2018 at 09:42 AM.
    Favorite characters:
    5 DC- Roy Harper, Donna Troy, Helena Bertinelli, Dinah Laurel Lance and Big Barda
    5 Marvel- Jean Grey, Richard Rider, Natasha Romanoff, Clint Barton and Angelica Jones

    Pull List:
    X-Men Red, X-Men Blue, Rogue&Gambit, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye, Marvel Two-in-One, Aquaman, Mister Miracle, Titans (Donna and Roy), Flash, Mera Queen of Atlantis, The Terrifics and some more.

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