Page 12 of 12 FirstFirst ... 289101112
Results 166 to 180 of 180
  1. #166
    Last Son of Shaolin GreatKungLao's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Russia
    Posts
    388

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mr_crisp View Post
    I had to laugh reading this issue. Oz is saying how bad and awful humans are and yet he's having them doing the things that he is complaining about.
    He only gave them an opportunity to pick evil choice and they went with it. It was humanity's fault in the end anyway, not his. A person who allows himself to be manipulated is the one responsible at the end of the day.

  2. #167
    (formerly "Superman") JAK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    iowa
    Posts
    730

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatKungLao View Post
    He only gave them an opportunity to pick evil choice and they went with it. It was humanity's fault in the end anyway, not his. A person who allows himself to be manipulated is the one responsible at the end of the day.
    Yeah, but there's a reason that "aiding and abetting" a crime is also a crime. He didn't pull the trigger, but he is the manipulator. I'd say that definitely fits one definition of abetting:

    To urge on, stimulate (a person to do) something desirable.


    I just had a thought... what if Jor-El is something akin to what Lois and Clark were pre-Reborn? If he was taken from a sliver of time instead of saved altogether? And whoever did that is where Brainiac found out about the idea. And that Ozymandias took him and brainwashed him for his own ends. But these time remnants are different, unstable. And certain things can interrupt their energy and they'll dissipate.

    One of the other things I'd love to see is that, maybe, there's more than one Oz, and the last one (current) is Jor-El. The first one Ozy tried to brainwash went along with it at first just to try and escape but was found and put "back in his cage". He gets free at the best possible moment, saving Clark, Lois, and Jon. By dissipating the Jor-El remnant with what looks like.....

    ...

    a shovel.

    It's Pa Kent. Also taken from a sliver of time, and was able to "save" Ma the same way.


    So they did still die when Clark was little, but by this crazy twist of fate.. here they are.

    Yeah, it's crazy, but it'd be cool to see. Plus, it would account for Mr. Oz calling Superman Clark for quite awhile before calling him Kal-El. There were two Oz's.
    Hear my new CD "Love The World Away", available on iTunes, Google Music, Spotify, Shazam, and Amazon: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B01N5XYV..._waESybX1C0RXK via @amazon
    www.jamiekelleymusic.com
    TV interview here: https://snjtoday.com/snj-today-hotline-jamie-kelley/

  3. #168
    Amazing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    58

    Default

    I'm still going with Ozymandius working behind the scenes. Could he have created a clone of Clark using blood and other material from the 1992 doomsday fight and encrypted it with memories, sounds etc. of Krypton To create a Jor-el imposter like he did with the squid?

  4. #169
    Invincible Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    11,499

    Default

    Very possible Ozymandias is a force behind the scenes. In fact I'd almost bank on it. There's a theme of intellect stomping intellect here. Lex is headed to ruin by Jor-El. Superman and Dr. Manhattan are headed for a showdown that sounds a lot like it will be more a intellectual battle than a physical one. Something else ruining Jor-El would make a lot of sense. And I still don't see it fitting Manhattan's character of being a malicious force, and it looks to me like Jor-El is, in a way, tortured after being rescued.

    In any case though I'm not buying him or anyone else actually being incognito pretending to be Jor-El.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 09-17-2017 at 04:57 PM.
    They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son. - Jor-El.

  5. #170

    Default

    Well, that was a surprise. Like, that was totally out of left field and I don't know what to think. If this is Jor El, he's changed so much that he's effectively a different man.

    Something doesn't feel right.

  6. #171
    Spectacular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    192

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Street View Post
    Well, that was a surprise. Like, that was totally out of left field and I don't know what to think. If this is Jor El, he's changed so much that he's effectively a different man.

    Something doesn't feel right.
    DC Comics doesn't feel right. I'll tell ya

  7. #172
    Spectacular Member Lvenger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Posts
    243

    Default

    Again this isn't the first time Jor-El has been portrayed as a morally ambiguous and cynical manipulator behind the scenes for Superman as opposed to the golden idol fans are familiar with in All Star Superman where he gives the "They will join you in the sun" speech. Smallville's Jor-El was a massive dick to Clark who controlled him, allowed him to save Lana at the cost of Jonathan Kent's life, took away his powers and other worst father of the year stuff. Unless it's done poorly, it's not necessarily character assassination.

  8. #173
    Mighty Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,121

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JAK View Post
    Yeah, but there's a reason that "aiding and abetting" a crime is also a crime. He didn't pull the trigger, but he is the manipulator. I'd say that definitely fits one definition of abetting:

    To urge on, stimulate (a person to do) something desirable.


    I just had a thought... what if Jor-El is something akin to what Lois and Clark were pre-Reborn? If he was taken from a sliver of time instead of saved altogether? And whoever did that is where Brainiac found out about the idea. And that Ozymandias took him and brainwashed him for his own ends. But these time remnants are different, unstable. And certain things can interrupt their energy and they'll dissipate.

    One of the other things I'd love to see is that, maybe, there's more than one Oz, and the last one (current) is Jor-El. The first one Ozy tried to brainwash went along with it at first just to try and escape but was found and put "back in his cage". He gets free at the best possible moment, saving Clark, Lois, and Jon. By dissipating the Jor-El remnant with what looks like.....

    ...

    a shovel.

    It's Pa Kent. Also taken from a sliver of time, and was able to "save" Ma the same way.


    So they did still die when Clark was little, but by this crazy twist of fate.. here they are.

    Yeah, it's crazy, but it'd be cool to see. Plus, it would account for Mr. Oz calling Superman Clark for quite awhile before calling him Kal-El. There were two Oz's.
    One of my theories about Oz, if he is indeed a version of Jor-El, is that Oz is basically the New 52 take on Jor-El.

    The New 52 has in-universe been established as a corruption of the DCU and its timeline. Its the result of Manhattan tampering with the DCU. Maybe one of the things Manhattan tampered with was saving Jor-El from Krypton's destruction and 'corrupting' him into becoming Mr. Oz. Maybe this is somehow tied in with the 'splitting' of Superman into two entities.

    Once the two Supermen merged and the 'Rebirth' timeline was created, Mr. Oz remained as a kind of anomaly. Or maybe he's now the Rebirth Jor-El.

  9. #174
    Mighty Member FishyZombie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    1,943

    Default

    Dc has released an sneak peak at Action comics #988.
    Oz Vs Superman.jpg

  10. #175
    Mighty Member theoneandonly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    1,910

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FishyZombie View Post
    Dc has released an sneak peak at Action comics #988.
    Oz Vs Superman.jpg
    LOL. Imagine Superman saying I have been a bad boy and giving up his tights and pants to don the kryptonian robes and joining oz on his mission whatever it may be.
    The Self is the only existing reality

  11. #176

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bat39 View Post
    One of my theories about Oz, if he is indeed a version of Jor-El, is that Oz is basically the New 52 take on Jor-El.

    The New 52 has in-universe been established as a corruption of the DCU and its timeline. Its the result of Manhattan tampering with the DCU. Maybe one of the things Manhattan tampered with was saving Jor-El from Krypton's destruction and 'corrupting' him into becoming Mr. Oz. Maybe this is somehow tied in with the 'splitting' of Superman into two entities.

    Once the two Supermen merged and the 'Rebirth' timeline was created, Mr. Oz remained as a kind of anomaly. Or maybe he's now the Rebirth Jor-El.
    This makes a lot of sense. We know that Oz was aware of the two Supermen situation. He called the new52 version "Clark," the older version "Superman," and the current combined version "Kal El," which suggests that he had definite opinions about what was going on. That is, only the current version is truly his son. So he transcends or predates the timeline craziness somehow. And the blue energy godlike being (who's almost certainly Dr. Manhattan) already created a dystopian timeline to mess with Batman's father, so maybe he's done something similar to Jor El.

  12. #177
    Mighty Member L.R Johansson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,198

    Default

    So... first time reading Superman in over a year - curiosity finally pulled me back in.

    Not sure what to say about this issue... it's... interesting?

    Quickly on the art - I felt that the art was generally good, although not to my personal tastes - a few panels here and there seemed to could have needed more work though, they looked rougher, a bit scribbly.

    Silly side-note - I at first thought Victor Bogdanovic was John Bogdanove's younger brother! And that Jurgens was doing a favour for his old pal, showing his younger brother the ropes - alas, then I realized my mistake, lol! Not even the same name..!

    Anyways, I'm luckily too jaded and have enough perspective to not be as entirely shocked and upset about the reveal just right now - after "Hail Hydra" one does get perspectives. We'll see how it develops, but I truly hope Jurgens and Johns have some GOOD pay-off for this one, as it does mess with the mythos.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Street View Post
    This makes a lot of sense. We know that Oz was aware of the two Supermen situation. He called the new52 version "Clark," the older version "Superman," and the current combined version "Kal El," which suggests that he had definite opinions about what was going on. That is, only the current version is truly his son. So he transcends or predates the timeline craziness somehow. And the blue energy godlike being (who's almost certainly Dr. Manhattan) already created a dystopian timeline to mess with Batman's father, so maybe he's done something similar to Jor El.
    Hmm, what are the issue-numbers and such, regarding the whole storyline which explained (? well, mostly, I understand it?) the whole deal with New-52 and Post-Crisis Superman? As I understand it, there was IMPORTANT supplementary material in Trinity, was there not? Like, even a confrontation between New-52 and Post-Crisis, told in... Flashback.

    Which sounds idiotic - because that could have been a GREAT, emotional and powerful issue of real-time events in Action Comics! But alas, ok. Whatever.

    So, issue-numbers and such, which explains it ALL?

    (I'm guessing not everything is quite clear yet though - seeing as the PURPOSE of the time-space-shenanigans have not yet been revealed, nor the orchestrator)

  13. #178
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    2,516

    Default

    This issue has, according to DC, "almost sold out"

    https://www.newsarama.com/36465-acti...s-artists.html

    Also, Zircher won't be be on art next issue, instead the duties will be handled by Viktor Bogdanovic
    Last edited by Miles To Go; 09-19-2017 at 09:30 AM.

  14. #179
    Fantastic Member Soubhagya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Posts
    293

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by L.R Johansson View Post
    Hmm, what are the issue-numbers and such, regarding the whole storyline which explained (? well, mostly, I understand it?) the whole deal with New-52 and Post-Crisis Superman? As I understand it, there was IMPORTANT supplementary material in Trinity, was there not? Like, even a confrontation between New-52 and Post-Crisis, told in... Flashback.

    Which sounds idiotic - because that could have been a GREAT, emotional and powerful issue of real-time events in Action Comics! But alas, ok. Whatever.

    So, issue-numbers and such, which explains it ALL?

    (I'm guessing not everything is quite clear yet though - seeing as the PURPOSE of the time-space-shenanigans have not yet been revealed, nor the orchestrator)
    To understand this i think one needs only:

    -Superman Rebirth #1
    -Superman Reborn(Collects Action Comics #973-976 and Superman #18-19)

    To understand what happened after Reborn you may check Action Comics #977 and #978.

    The link gives the issues covering Reborn Aftermath and issues with appearances of Mr. Oz. after Rebirth.

    http://www.howtolovecomics.com/2017/...reading-order/

    If you want to know more about Post-Crisis Superman you may check out 'Lois and Clark' which spun out of the previous event Convergence. This brought Post-Crisis Lois Lane and Clark Kent to the New 52.

    To read about the final fate of New 52 Superman you may check out 'Final Days of Superman'. Superman Reborn crossover was the resolution to the two Superman story. Doomsday Clock will finally end the story.

    Most important issues are Rebirth #1 and Reborn Crossover. Post Reborn issues are not really necessary. To understand what happened only Action Comics #977 and #978 may be sufficient. Others are supplementary. Not required but you may choose to read them as you desire.

    If there are any queries you can check out here. I am sure this might have been discussed in these threads. Or you can ask.

    Thank you. I am happy to help.

  15. #180
    Mighty Member L.R Johansson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,198

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Soubhagya View Post
    To understand this i think one needs only:

    -Superman Rebirth #1
    -Superman Reborn(Collects Action Comics #973-976 and Superman #18-19)

    To understand what happened after Reborn you may check Action Comics #977 and #978.

    The link gives the issues covering Reborn Aftermath and issues with appearances of Mr. Oz. after Rebirth.

    http://www.howtolovecomics.com/2017/...reading-order/

    If you want to know more about Post-Crisis Superman you may check out 'Lois and Clark' which spun out of the previous event Convergence. This brought Post-Crisis Lois Lane and Clark Kent to the New 52.

    To read about the final fate of New 52 Superman you may check out 'Final Days of Superman'. Superman Reborn crossover was the resolution to the two Superman story. Doomsday Clock will finally end the story.

    Most important issues are Rebirth #1 and Reborn Crossover. Post Reborn issues are not really necessary. To understand what happened only Action Comics #977 and #978 may be sufficient. Others are supplementary. Not required but you may choose to read them as you desire.

    If there are any queries you can check out here. I am sure this might have been discussed in these threads. Or you can ask.

    Thank you. I am happy to help.
    Ey, cheers! = ) Thanks for the run-down of the necessary issues. I've sadly read Final Days of Superman, and read the first issue of Lois and Clark, so I have some idea about the Kent-family thing.

    Good to see that the story seems to be drawing to a close at last. I may not actually keep reading Superman after this, but I do feel as if I need to finally read the resolution to all of this shenanigans.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •