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  1. #1

    Default Wolverine with the Power Gem VS Hulk

    Wolverine swallows the power gem.
    Wolverine figures he will be able to defeat Hulk with this additional power.
    Can he?

    Who wins?

    If wolverine gets stomped, what is the strongest Marvel Characters he could beat with the Power Gem???

  2. #2
    Mighty Member
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    The power gem, and most gems in general, offer vastly different levels of oomph based on the competency of the wielder. Aside from that one Spider-Man/Wolverine comic of questionable Canon, do we have much reason to think Logan would be especially good at wielding a cosmic artifact?

    And/or, does the gem have any feats for taking what is basically a normal human and turning them into a class 100?

  3. #3
    Astonishing Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Morgan View Post
    The power gem, and most gems in general, offer vastly different levels of oomph based on the competency of the wielder. Aside from that one Spider-Man/Wolverine comic of questionable Canon, do we have much reason to think Logan would be especially good at wielding a cosmic artifact?

    And/or, does the gem have any feats for taking what is basically a normal human and turning them into a class 100?
    He did use the Crystal of Ultimate Vision pretty elaborately for the short time he had it, but that one seemed to be extremely user friendly compared to at least the Reality Gem (though to be fair, the Reality Gem is by far the most difficult Infinity Gem to manipulate solo), what with it being a temptation trap and all.

  4. #4
    Astonishing Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    I'm thin on Wolverine being one of the sorts that manages to get vast mileage out of the power gem compared to just a measure of across the board physical boost that most others get.

    I can't really recall anything for it turning a normal human into a class 100, no, but I could be forgetting something.

    Still, if it only made him, say, Thing strong, he could pretty much stab the Hulk in the brain and fight over.

  5. #5
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    Parker Robins, immediately after receiving the Power gem, beat the tar out of the Red Hulk.

  6. #6
    Prince of Duckness Beadle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crawfo View Post
    Parker Robins, immediately after receiving the Power gem, beat the tar out of the Red Hulk.
    Well, that proves it CAN do it, but we’re also talking about someone with express experience of using high-powered artefacts before (his cloak) and at that point in time he didn’t just have the Power Gem but also the Mind, Reality and Space Gems (and I’m not sure whether the Mind Gem would help him in getting more out of the Power Gem).

    So it still doesn’t follow that Logan could do it. And we’ve seen how someone like Steve Rogers can basically screw up Infinity Gems, so there’s a proven competence failure for someone of unspectacular intelligence.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beadle View Post
    Well, that proves it CAN do it, but we’re also talking about someone with express experience of using high-powered artefacts before (his cloak) and at that point in time he didn’t just have the Power Gem but also the Mind, Reality and Space Gems (and I’m not sure whether the Mind Gem would help him in getting more out of the Power Gem).

    So it still doesn’t follow that Logan could do it. And we’ve seen how someone like Steve Rogers can basically screw up Infinity Gems, so there’s a proven competence failure for someone of unspectacular intelligence.
    As I understand it, the power gem was a "booster" of the other gems potential, it never worked the other way, so the mind gem would not have helped. Also when Parker first beat the Red Hulk he only had the reality gem and the power gem. He himself noted was still learning how the reality gem worked, and he had literally just taken possession of the power gem, which let him throw down and beat the Red Hulk. Parker showed no real competency with the gems to the extent that the Watcher was calling him out on how basic his use of them were, but even so he won fist fights with class 100's, and without even knowing how, as stated in story, he telepathically bested Xavier after just coming into possession of the mind gem..

    As to your second point, Steve Rogers isn't unfamiliar with using items of power, Mjolnir, Cosmic cubes, the Beyonder's energies, the full Nova corps power, and he was ultimately successful in pushing back an entire universe with the IG right? He broke the Gems doing so, but he successfully used them to accomplish his goal, how is that a competency issue? It was a plot point. The whole point of the Time Runs Out story was that the heroes had no chance of success.
    Last edited by Crawfo; 10-08-2017 at 02:41 PM.

  8. #8
    Astonishing Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    As I understand it, the power gem was a "booster" of the other gems potential, it never worked the other way, so the mind gem would not have helped.
    It's somewhat more accurate to say in the gauntlet that the other gems guide the use of the power of the power gem into their respective fields of influence as much as anything, on its own in the hands of a competent wielder it can do things like power up their manifested insanities (and indeed help make them manifest), for instance. Thanos also got a lot of mileage out of restricting himself to just the power gem when he killed the hero strike team in Infinity Gauntlet.

    As to your second point, Steve Rogers isn't unfamiliar with using items of power, Mjolnir, Cosmic cubes, the Beyonder's energies, the full Nova corps power, and he was ultimately successful in pushing back an entire universe with the IG right? He broke the Gems doing so, but he successfully used them to accomplish his goal, how is that a competency issue?
    An incomplete gauntlet (missing the reality gem, which again is part of the whole deal that the power gem can be used for things like monkeying with reality, it's just incredibly harder without the right gem to guide said power) has managed to overwrite an entire universe with a different universe, then later put the whole thing back together when it was falling apart and restore it to normal (if at cost to the user). Compared to that, Steve was markedly inept.
    Last edited by Pendaran; 10-08-2017 at 03:54 PM.

  9. #9
    Truth and Conviction Hazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beadle View Post
    And we’ve seen how someone like Steve Rogers can basically screw up Infinity Gems, so there’s a proven competence failure for someone of unspectacular intelligence.
    To be fair, that was mostly the writing wanting to screw over everyone.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    It's somewhat more accurate to say in the gauntlet that the other gems guide the use of the power of the power gem into their respective fields of influence as much as anything, on its own in the hands of a competent wielder it can do things like power up their manifested insanities (and indeed help make them manifest), for instance. Thanos also got a lot of mileage out of restricting himself to just the power gem when he killed the hero strike team in Infinity Gauntlet.



    An incomplete gauntlet (missing the reality gem, which again is part of the whole deal that the power gem can be used for things like monkeying with reality, it's just incredibly harder without the right gem to guide said power) has managed to overwrite an entire universe with a different universe, then later put the whole thing back together when it was falling apart and restore it to normal (if at cost to the user). Compared to that, Steve was markedly inept.
    To be fair, how much of that latter stuff was before they started retconning the Gauntlet and making it only work in 616?

    I agree with you on the stuff about the power gem powering the other stuff though. Unless Marvel retconned that too.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    It's somewhat more accurate to say in the gauntlet that the other gems guide the use of the power of the power gem into their respective fields of influence as much as anything, on its own in the hands of a competent wielder it can do things like power up their manifested insanities (and indeed help make them manifest), for instance. Thanos also got a lot of mileage out of restricting himself to just the power gem when he killed the hero strike team in Infinity Gauntlet.
    Po-tay-to, po-tah-to.

    An incomplete gauntlet (missing the reality gem, which again is part of the whole deal that the power gem can be used for things like monkeying with reality, it's just incredibly harder without the right gem to guide said power) has managed to overwrite an entire universe with a different universe, then later put the whole thing back together when it was falling apart and restore it to normal (if at cost to the user). Compared to that, Steve was markedly inept.
    It's not a fair comparison. The incomplete IG didn't accomplish the reality re-write of the milky way galaxy by itself, the process was already well underway by dint of a cache of cosmic cubes. The incomplete gauntlet sped that process along.

  12. #12

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    Hulk isn't a fighting genius, but shouldn't he be as fast or faster than Wolverine?
    That guy who beat Red Hulk....um..is Red Hulk on par with really angry Hulk?

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crawfo View Post
    Po-tay-to, po-tah-to.



    It's not a fair comparison. The incomplete IG didn't accomplish the reality re-write of the milky way galaxy by itself, the process was already well underway by dint of a cache of cosmic cubes. The incomplete gauntlet sped that process along.
    It's a fair comparison just fine, it did up the universe, not just the galaxy, and considering the incomplete gauntlet proceeded to later restore all that to normal anyway at the end, a process nowhere remotely underway whatsoever, I'm pretty cool standing by "Adam with an incomplete gauntlet completely outperformed Steve when he had it".

  14. #14
    Prince of Duckness Beadle's Avatar
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    And just as a quick note regarding Steve ‘using’ Mjolnir, to the best of my knowledge he remains the only person to have lifted it NOT to have been given the power of Thor. I mean it’s actually written on the side of Mjolnir that whosoever shall be worthy and whatnot, and yet Steve Rogers was still just ‘Some Peak Human Dude Holding A Hammer’.

  15. #15
    Mighty Member Shellhead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beadle View Post
    And just as a quick note regarding Steve ‘using’ Mjolnir, to the best of my knowledge he remains the only person to have lifted it NOT to have been given the power of Thor. I mean it’s actually written on the side of Mjolnir that whosoever shall be worthy and whatnot, and yet Steve Rogers was still just ‘Some Peak Human Dude Holding A Hammer’.
    Oh god that's true. I never really thought about it at the time, but all Steve did was swing the hammer around in circles to hit bunches of armored mooks. No lightning, no flying through the sky, no bullet deflection, and definitely no esoteric stunts like d-dumping or transmutation. It's like Steve is just too basic to imagine how to use the hammer for more than just bludgeoning attacks.

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