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  1. #1
    Astonishing Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Default Constitutional monarchy for the Amazons?

    One thing I would have loved to have been explored is the whole democracy plot line with the amazons. What about you guys? How much power should Hippoltya had? I always thought about it this way. The amazon shave tribes elect their leader and council. This council goes to themscryia to pass laws for the whole island

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    From whats on the pages, the Amazons have usually had an absolute monarchy where Hippolyta is the ultimate authority, as appointed by the gods. After Hippolyta died in Our Worlds at War, the mantle of rulership simply split between 2 people. And with her petrification in the New 52, it was changed to a more democratic council.

    What i wouldn't have minded in the old stories with the monarchy, was a nod to how places like Sparta had a council called Ephors who were elected to keep an eye on the 2 kings they usually had.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    One thing I would have loved to have been explored is the whole democracy plot line with the amazons. What about you guys? How much power should Hippoltya had? I always thought about it this way. The amazon shave tribes elect their leader and council. This council goes to themscryia to pass laws for the whole island
    I preferred the democracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    I preferred the democracy.
    Served with Freedom and a Bald Eagle! O.O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outside_85 View Post
    Served with Freedom and a Bald Eagle! O.O

    j/k
    Sorry I don't get the joke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Sorry I don't get the joke.
    I was thinking of an Obama knock knock meme where he is in the door with a bald eagle. (I can't post it here because they have one of the dirty words in it.)

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    What's the population size? What's the land mass? It's things like this that would determine the carrying capacity for a full-blown democracy.

    I doubt they need it. There's probably not that many and they're all living within hours of each of each other--not days apart by horse--so there'd be no reason for an American or British style representative democracy. They proabably have an informal direct democracy, yet with a queen, because all the sisters can voice their opinion at once.

    I'd prefer a triumvirate of queens, where Melanippe is the leader of their worship, Antiope is the leader of their army and Hippolyte is the leader of their economy. However, I'm okay with the gods having appointed Hippolyte the queen and all the sister Amazons agreeing to this.

    Simple societies work like that. Everyone is equal, but one person is the leader. There's no need for a sophisticated government for such a small pppulation size, because they are all co-existing person to person in one place.
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    Mighty Member Soubhagya's Avatar
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    To be honest there won't be any democracy in Themyscira. Changes in systems of government takes place when government is not functioning properly. Kings were removed when they misused their powers. Democracies were replaced by monarchies when democracies were not effective.

    Monarchy works perfectly in Themyscira. It is Paradise Island! They are living in perfect peace and harmony. There is no one true model of government. Democracy is over rated. We can't fit it everywhere to work.

    Monarchy can work if the head of government is as selfless and effective as Hippolyta. Her consistent performance over thousands of years speaks for itself. To show a change to constitutional monarchy it will make sense either if they show that the system does not work or she chooses that herself.

    I read Thor for 10 issues or so after the reveal of Jane Foster. (I dropped it for its grim premise). They went out of their way to show that Odin is not right for Asgard. He has turned into a despot who is ruining Asgard. If they take that direction something like Sovereign definitely make sense.

    Or else, Hippolyta does this herself. Though effectively immortal there is a possibility that she can die. Further she can fear that i may loose my sense of service to my subjects and my sisters. She can make it a failsafe. The system works. Simply add a body who can advise her. The body is a failsafe. If she dies or if she turns bad this body comprising of mostly the intellectual Amazons shall find a suitable replacement.

    If they want interesting stories with constitutional monarchy they will have to break down the illusion that Themyscira is Paradise Island. That is a retcon in my opinion.

    There is no need of a written constitution. There is something called too much government. If a system is too complicated it works against its proper functioning. As Jim Kelly pointed out you have a relatively small population living in a small island. Add in the fact that Amazons are naturally peaceful you can simply have a queen who can listen to her subjects.

    Or if this constitutional monarchy sounds so cool, throw all real world logic out of the window. Democracy is considered an advanced form of government. Constitutional monarchy is considered as a transistional phase. Since Amazons are advanced they started with monarchy but changed into constitutional monarchy without any conflict or bloodshed. It lines up with the vision of Marston of Amazon society being a utopia.

    But it is simply cosmetic. To have interesting stories to read we have to return to Themyscira again and again. In addition to that it shall be shown that Themyscira is as fallible as other societies.
    Last edited by Soubhagya; 10-09-2017 at 08:41 AM.

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    Astonishing Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Technically yes they do live their life in peace but even in Golden age it shows they are still flawed like a society. They might not have any crimes and have anything handled but certain as writer change still show amazons who do want change but go about it their own way. Having a Democray doesn’t make them a flawed society.


    We don’t know the population size. I do think it would be interesting if they were larger than many think.

    Well even a monarchy needs a council. I mean if you look at some monarchical governments the leader can pick whoever they want. I’m saying the amazons should be a democracy not because they do have a paradise but they made it a paradise but still have problems. Not do to themselves all the time but things like the Doom gate and a few other serious problems depending on the writer.
    Last edited by AmiMizuno; 10-09-2017 at 08:44 AM.
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    Mighty Member Soubhagya's Avatar
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    What i meant was going by real world logic there is no need for constitutional monarchy. If everything is alright why would they want to change?

    But i gave another option. Since they are advanced they can make the change themselves. Constitutional monarchy shows they are far more advanced then we give them credit. Without any bloodshed they made that transition. It is cool and shows how great Amazons are.

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    Astonishing Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soubhagya View Post
    What i meant was going by real world logic there is no need for constitutional monarchy. If everything is alright why would they want to change?

    But i gave another option. Since they are advanced they can make the change themselves. Constitutional monarchy shows they are far more advanced then we give them credit. Without any bloodshed they made that transition. It is cool and shows how great Amazons are.
    Agreed. I wonder how big should the Amazons? I mean if we look at the different times Paradise Island has been shown it does look like many different islands. Maybe a good amount? Enough to have a large group but not taking over the Island? Is half million
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    Agreed. I wonder how big should the Amazons? I mean if we look at the different times Paradise Island has been shown it does look like many different islands. Maybe a good amount? Enough to have a large group but not taking over the Island? Is half million
    Half a million? You'll be lucky if theres even 5000 of them.
    Rucka actually gave them around 3000 inhabitants in his first run... which admittedly doesn't harmonize with Amazons Attack where they could fill the National Mall.

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    I do think the Amazons should be a good size population. How big should they be? I mean we know that they will always have food to eat in many runs of the goddesses help.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmiMizuno View Post
    I do think the Amazons should be a good size population. How big should they be? I mean we know that they will always have food to eat in many runs of the goddesses help.
    Yes, but the reason they can do this is basically down to their very static population figures and that they are always in a kind of equilibrium with the land around them. So the bigger the population, the bigger the island and the larger the area dedicated to agriculture has to be. And half a million people... thats approaching the size of ancient Rome.

    Normally when I've given thought to this matter, I've normally settled on there only ever being around 20.000 Amazons of those who came out of the lake and lived on the mainland. As time went by, they've endured (post-Crisis), the amount that was left would be down to around 5000 including the Bana-additions. Since Antiope rode off with half the population after Heracles, and Byrne had Darkseid show up and kill off half of the remains.

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    Astonishing Member AmiMizuno's Avatar
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    This is why I do think the amazons should keep up their pooulation whether it be divine or sex raids ( but it’s consent ) or Earth One technology. I mean they have to have enough amazons to protected themselves and the evil they are guarding
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