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  1. #61
    Astonishing Member Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    That's ironic because I assumed he was the one version everyone liked!
    Yes and no.

    I read several of the collections of the Golden Age stories and I really liked the whole maverick aspect. But there's a point where, no matter how good the good guy is and how bad the bad guys are, you just get sick and tired of seeing a guy who knows nobody can stop him stomping on people he knows have no chance against him and you just want someone to royally kick his @$$ (sort of like watching a Stephen Seagal movie).

    Interestingly enough, if you could just get people today to accept that version of Superman (which you wouldn't), he would be a very popular character to do a movie or show about because he's basically a Wish Fulfillment fantasy as opposed to the Silver Age Superman who is the opposite of that, the guy who is supremely powerful but puts absolute limits on himself. On the surface, the Golden Age Superman, whether set in the 1930s or today, should be a big hit because people generally love the characters with lack of control who do what they want. But for most people that's not the image of Superman they have set in their minds.
    The Four Levels of Competence
    Unconscious incompetence - where one is not aware one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious incompetence - where one has trained enough to finally figured out one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious competence - where one has skill, but needs to concentrate and think about everything as one is doing it.
    Unconscious competence - where one has hardwired stuff in enough that one doesn't actually think about what one is doing, but just does it.
    -SharpandPointies

  2. #62
    Mighty Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    Yes and no.

    I read several of the collections of the Golden Age stories and I really liked the whole maverick aspect. But there's a point where, no matter how good the good guy is and how bad the bad guys are, you just get sick and tired of seeing a guy who knows nobody can stop him stomping on people he knows have no chance against him and you just want someone to royally kick his @$$ (sort of like watching a Stephen Seagal movie).

    Interestingly enough, if you could just get people today to accept that version of Superman (which you wouldn't), he would be a very popular character to do a movie or show about because he's basically a Wish Fulfillment fantasy as opposed to the Silver Age Superman who is the opposite of that, the guy who is supremely powerful but puts absolute limits on himself. On the surface, the Golden Age Superman, whether set in the 1930s or today, should be a big hit because people generally love the characters with lack of control who do what they want. But for most people that's not the image of Superman they have set in their minds.
    To me the fact that Golden Age Superman so often made it a point to fight against oppressors and for the underdog mitigates the concern about "punching down", because he's not bullying anyone, he's standing up for those who can't fight for themselves- immigrant workers, orphans, widows, the poor- anyone vulnerable. "Champion of the Weak and the Oppressed", the radio show called him, and to me that's what made the fact he'd never leave an ass unkicked acceptable- even fun.

    Of course, he didn't stay like that for that long, even into the early forties that was starting to drop off, and I think more intellectually challenging stories and foes for the Man of Steel like "the League to Destroy Superman", Luthor, the Evil Three from Krypton, and the eventual development of the fifties and sixties where Superman was kind of a puzzle-based character... that probably all happened as a response to some version of your concern, so in that regard it's a very valid claim to make. Still, I'm disappointed that he kind of lost the "Champion of the Oppressed" element in all that for a while, and became (and remains, for the most part) a less class-aware character.

    I suppose that's why I like both the Cavill and New 52 versions of the character so much, despite their almost irreconcilably different backgrounds and influences-- they're both very concerned with "fighting for those who can't fight for themselves".
    Last edited by Adekis; 11-06-2017 at 12:31 PM.
    "You know the deal, Metropolis. Treat people right or expect a visit from me."

  3. #63

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    Loved MOS Superman! That made the character seem both powerful & human. He isn't perfect & I like that he has to get his hands dirty. Most impressive displays of his powers ever. This IS Superman for me. Only live action version I've enjoyed.

    Injustice Superman is the most interesting version I've read in the comics. There's always a part of me that thinks it would be a great twist to have him become the greatest villain on the universe. It's like playing a video game & taking the main character & just going nuts. I know it's weird. Superman would make an awesome villain.

  4. #64
    DARKSEID LAUGHS... Crazy Diamond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manofsteel1979 View Post
    Yeah...suddenly that scene in Superman III where he happily eats alpo doesn't seem so out of left field!
    It makes sense. I guess his taste buds work differently than ours. Imagine all the flavors he can detect that we can't. There probably aren't words to describe them.

  5. #65

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    Although I enjoy all the pre-Crisis Superman (except for the odd imaginary story), I also have a soft spot for the radio show. I have listed to a few hundred of them and they spark my imagination because in my mind, they are all drawn by Swan.

  6. #66
    Astonishing Member Powerboy's Avatar
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    Started this message before, had paragraphs done and then lost it so this is going to be the short version.

    I have a fondness for the Golden Age Superman as Defender of the Oppressed. Although I started longing for him to have a real opponent, that did happen at the end of the first year.

    There are times within the era of the Silver Age Superman I love.

    Not a popular opinion around here but I love the early Bronze Age when they finally shook up the status quo that had endured for decades. Clark Kent as a television reporter, Kryptonite no more, Lois Lane coming into her own, Superman depowered but in a good way that led to good stories (and it didn't last long), Sand Superman storyline and so on. Truly revamped my interest in Superman.

    The George Reeves Superman is a favorite. He was my physical image of Superman and I liked his personality especially in the first two seasons.

    Loved the first Christopher Reeve Superman movie and even the second was good minus about three scenes (crushing Zod's hand, beating somebody up for revenge and Amnesia Kiss).

    Back in the 1980s, I loved the John Byrne Superman but I find the stories trite now compared to what went before.

    I like the Tyler Hoechlin Superman but he's kind of the feel good guest star that couldn't carry a show so more honorable mention than anything else.

    Strangely, despite my criticisms, there is a lot I like about the Henry Cavill Superman. Physically, he beats even George Reeves as my image of what live action Superman would look like. There are also elements of the character I like a lot and also a lot I don't like.
    The Four Levels of Competence
    Unconscious incompetence - where one is not aware one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious incompetence - where one has trained enough to finally figured out one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious competence - where one has skill, but needs to concentrate and think about everything as one is doing it.
    Unconscious competence - where one has hardwired stuff in enough that one doesn't actually think about what one is doing, but just does it.
    -SharpandPointies

  7. #67
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    I haven't actually watched enough of the George Reeves version to form an informed opinion of him yet but what little of it I have seen I liked. My opinion of Hoechlin Superman went down considerably after last season's finale. That may just be sour grapes on my part that I may get over as time goes by. I have my issues with the Byrne Superman. My opinion of him is mixed for reasons I won't go over again here.
    Listen, lady! I am thirteen years old and driving a Bat-hog through the Amazon on a Tuesday morning! I am ALREADY winning!

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  8. #68
    Astonishing Member Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superduperman View Post
    I haven't actually watched enough of the George Reeves version to form an informed opinion of him yet but what little of it I have seen I liked. My opinion of Hoechlin Superman went down considerably after last season's finale. That may just be sour grapes on my part that I may get over as time goes by. I have my issues with the Byrne Superman. My opinion of him is mixed for reasons I won't go over again here.
    I watch most shows on Netflix so I'm a year behind in my watching. I haven't seen the Supergirl episode you're talking about yet so time will tell.

    With Reeves, I like the straightforward innocence of the stories. But, separating his performance from the surroundings, I just plain like his take on Superman and his early take on Clark Kent in the first two seasons which is not the lovable doofus we think of from later years. It's as if, during the first two seasons, it's the Golden Age Superman then the rest of the series is strictly for kids and he becomes the Silver Age Superman. That also has its merits.
    The Four Levels of Competence
    Unconscious incompetence - where one is not aware one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious incompetence - where one has trained enough to finally figured out one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious competence - where one has skill, but needs to concentrate and think about everything as one is doing it.
    Unconscious competence - where one has hardwired stuff in enough that one doesn't actually think about what one is doing, but just does it.
    -SharpandPointies

  9. #69
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    Not a popular opinion around here but I love the early Bronze Age when they finally shook up the status quo that had endured for decades. Clark Kent as a television reporter, Kryptonite no more, Lois Lane coming into her own, Superman depowered but in a good way that led to good stories (and it didn't last long), Sand Superman storyline and so on. Truly revamped my interest in Superman.
    Really? I thought the Bronze Age was pretty popular here.

    You people dont like the Bronze Age? What the hell? I thought better of all of you!!

    Higher, Faster, Further....More.

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    Invincible: The greatest superhero comic in the universe!

  10. #70
    Notorious M.O.S. Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    Not a popular opinion around here but I love the early Bronze Age when they finally shook up the status quo that had endured for decades. Clark Kent as a television reporter, Kryptonite no more, Lois Lane coming into her own, Superman depowered but in a good way that led to good stories (and it didn't last long), Sand Superman storyline and so on. Truly revamped my interest in Superman.
    I've never been wise to the fan consensus of Kryptonite Nevermore. Generally it seems that the Bronze Age is sometimes considered the best, I guess because of where his powers were?

    KN always had the most value to me as being a cut off, actually. Where I start my greatest love of Superman from the point following that until about 1976. I guess this will sound weird but I think of him as the Elton John Superman because I love his songs from then and think of them when I see the Superman of the same era.

    This then, of course, makes the Faith George Michael out of the Superman we had from 1993 until the end of....TIME.

    Or 1999. I guess that came first.

  11. #71
    Mighty Member Adekis's Avatar
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    I think the Bronze Age Superman is well-liked, but not well-known, even among his fans, few folks read every single Bronze Age Superman story. I definitely think the Golden, Silver and post-Crisis eras are all more widely-read, and more broadly-read too.

    I mean heck, I think he's the "Optimus Prime of Supermen", but I still haven't read half enough material featuring him.
    "You know the deal, Metropolis. Treat people right or expect a visit from me."

  12. #72
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    You know, Kryptonite Nevermore is one of the few classics I haven't had a chance to read yet......

    Actually, that and Sunshine Superman. I can't find that anywhere.

    As for the Bronze Age, I like it because the fantastical and whimsical elements of the Silver Age are still in play but the narrative is starting to pull together into something a little more layered and detailed and mature, more contemporary. It feels like the best of both worlds; the crazy big ideas of the Silver with the more character-focused development of the post-Crisis era. Clark starts feeling more like a real character and the new job (problematic though it is with his secret identity) feels fresh.

    Hard to go wrong with that, in my opinion.
    Higher, Faster, Further....More.

    Discipline = Freedom.

    Invincible: The greatest superhero comic in the universe!

  13. #73
    Mighty Member Adekis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    You know, Kryptonite Nevermore is one of the few classics I haven't had a chance to read yet......

    Actually, that and Sunshine Superman. I can't find that anywhere.

    As for the Bronze Age, I like it because the fantastical and whimsical elements of the Silver Age are still in play but the narrative is starting to pull together into something a little more layered and detailed and mature, more contemporary. It feels like the best of both worlds; the crazy big ideas of the Silver with the more character-focused development of the post-Crisis era. Clark starts feeling more like a real character and the new job (problematic though it is with his secret identity) feels fresh.

    Hard to go wrong with that, in my opinion.
    Agreed, 100%. There's relatively few flaws and very many elements of total greatness to this version of the character.

    "You know the deal, Metropolis. Treat people right or expect a visit from me."

  14. #74
    Notorious M.O.S. Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    Eh... I like the first chapter, and it's good that it's been reprinted several times. Strong start. The ending bits I've read about, and own through the best of DC digest (admittedly not the best presentation) . The strikes are a bad use of Superman crying and taking away the powers. That's twofold since the rest of the era was defined by his massive power and trippy adventures. Those powers aren't required for a good story but I personally didn't get the impression that they were being replaced with anything of strong storytelling substance. But who knows? At least it's easy to believe that this direction would have made crisis moot.

    Golden age is definitely my big blank spot. I don't feel that the gist is at all good enough and I'll definitely jump in headfirst this holiday season.

  15. #75
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagaton View Post
    Eh... I like the first chapter, and it's good that it's been reprinted several times. Strong start. The ending bits I've read about, and own through the best of DC digest (admittedly not the best presentation) . The strikes are a bad use of Superman crying and taking away the powers. That's twofold since the rest of the era was defined by his massive power and trippy adventures. Those powers aren't required for a good story but I personally didn't get the impression that they were being replaced with anything of strong storytelling substance. But who knows? At least it's easy to believe that this direction would have made crisis moot.

    Golden age is definitely my big blank spot. I don't feel that the gist is at all good enough and I'll definitely jump in headfirst this holiday season.
    Other than the modern, post-Crisis era that I actually experienced as it happened, I think the Golden Age is the era I am most familiar with.....got several collections from the old comics as well as the Sundays on my shelf.

    Which might explain why I enjoy a rougher, tougher Superman with more attitude than some of you guys.
    Higher, Faster, Further....More.

    Discipline = Freedom.

    Invincible: The greatest superhero comic in the universe!

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