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  1. #1
    Moderator oldschool's Avatar
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    Default Is it time for a hard reboot on Spidey?

    It seems to be that, since roughly the 1990's Clone Saga, Marvel has been trying to quietly reset Spidey and his world without losing what is one of the better continuities in comics. They tried to reset it again after returning Peter as "the one, true Spidey" after Ben died and then several times afterwards what with MJ seemed to die in that plane crash, then returned and left Peter, then returned again, then there was big shift in tone with JMS' arrival and the whole totem thing, then of course OMD and BND etc.

    My point is that much of this goes above and beyond the normal ebbs and flows of storytelling which is expected for a 55-year old character with thousands of stories in his vault. Many of these moves were designed as a "soft reboot" to either de-age or reset Peter and his universe; some worked better than others and the Ultimate Universe was another attempt to "get it right" (remember, there was a time circa 2000 that some thought the UU Peter would replace the 616 Peter since it was perceived that UU Spidey worked better at that time).

    And, post-BND, Marvel has tried again to make Peter the lovable single loser and, when that wore thin, they gave him----by way of Ock's machinations in Superior----his own international company and had him globe trot for the last few years before returning him to broke NYC status in the latest issues. So it seems they can't quite decide if he should be broke or successful, 20-something or 30-something, married or single, a team player or a loner, jokester or serious.

    It just may be time for a serious reboot. What say you?
    I miss Kevin Nichols. Not as much as bacon, but still...

  2. #2
    Astonishing Member SpiderClops's Avatar
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    No.

    10char.
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  3. #3
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    Most people do not want to see a hard reboot that destroys his past and starts from scratch.

    It worked with Ultimate Spider-Man because it did not touch the 616 universe at the time. I think a total reboot of 616 SM would would split the fanbase in half and the sales would decrease even more...

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
    It seems to be that, since roughly the 1990's Clone Saga, Marvel has been trying to quietly reset Spidey and his world without losing what is one of the better continuities in comics. They tried to reset it again after returning Peter as "the one, true Spidey" after Ben died and then several times afterwards what with MJ seemed to die in that plane crash, then returned and left Peter, then returned again, then there was big shift in tone with JMS' arrival and the whole totem thing, then of course OMD and BND etc.

    My point is that much of this goes above and beyond the normal ebbs and flows of storytelling which is expected for a 55-year old character with thousands of stories in his vault. Many of these moves were designed as a "soft reboot" to either de-age or reset Peter and his universe; some worked better than others and the Ultimate Universe was another attempt to "get it right" (remember, there was a time circa 2000 that some thought the UU Peter would replace the 616 Peter since it was perceived that UU Spidey worked better at that time).

    And, post-BND, Marvel has tried again to make Peter the lovable single loser and, when that wore thin, they gave him----by way of Ock's machinations in Superior----his own international company and had him globe trot for the last few years before returning him to broke NYC status in the latest issues. So it seems they can't quite decide if he should be broke or successful, 20-something or 30-something, married or single, a team player or a loner, jokester or serious.

    It just may be time for a serious reboot. What say you?
    Absolutely not.

    As for whether Marvel "can't decide" what Peter should be, the fact that different things happen to the character and that he experiences ebb and flow in his professional and personal life isn't evidence of a lack of editorial decisiveness, that's just stories being told.

    And since the beginning, Spidey has fluctuated between being a loner and a team player and between being a jokester and being serious so that's nothing new.

    Also, he's never been thirtysomething in regular continuity. He's twentysomething and he'll stay that way. And, clearly, he's staying single in the main MU.

  5. #5
    World's Greatest Hero blackspidey2099's Avatar
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    No. Never.

  6. #6
    Moderator oldschool's Avatar
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    I get that Spidey has a rich history and I don't think there should be a hard reboot, personally. It's just that the title hasn't had any true forward thrust for quite awhile thanks to the fact that there are few true lasting changes from the various "illusion of change" moves that Marvel makes. After Peter and MJ lost their baby, it was never mentioned again after a few issues; Aunt May "dying" and years later reappearing after being held captive by Norman was likewise waved away after just a few cursory mentions. It's well documented that MJ has been poorly handled since OMD and Peter's post-Superior return seemed rushed and without much consequence apart from bad story beats like Felicia "going bad". Just seems like there is no real straight editorial line any longer for the character and book.
    I miss Kevin Nichols. Not as much as bacon, but still...

  7. #7
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    They pissed all over established history with OMD. At this rate, they might as well reboot.

    That or make the RYV canon legit.

  8. #8
    Spectacular Member JTait's Avatar
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    I would reluctantly say yes. There have been too many retcons and revisions in recent years, and as a result Spider-Man's history no longer makes any real sense.

    The best example of this would be Norman Osborn's backstory, which is littered with inconsistencies and plot holes.

    I also think that, while I admire Dan Slott's courage in taking Peter Parker in some bold new directions, the current version of the character has deviated too far from what made him such a compelling protagonist.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldschool View Post
    I get that Spidey has a rich history and I don't think there should be a hard reboot, personally. It's just that the title hasn't had any true forward thrust for quite awhile thanks to the fact that there are few true lasting changes from the various "illusion of change" moves that Marvel makes. After Peter and MJ lost their baby, it was never mentioned again after a few issues; Aunt May "dying" and years later reappearing after being held captive by Norman was likewise waved away after just a few cursory mentions. It's well documented that MJ has been poorly handled since OMD and Peter's post-Superior return seemed rushed and without much consequence apart from bad story beats like Felicia "going bad". Just seems like there is no real straight editorial line any longer for the character and book.
    Are you kidding? Because you, personally, don't like the direction of the book or the character, Marvel needs to reboot it? Give me a break.

    Also, every single character in comics could be accused of not having "forward thrust" because they don't progress the way real people do. All characters that exist in a shared universe operate under an "illusion of change." Should they all be rebooted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    They pissed all over established history with OMD. At this rate, they might as well reboot.

    That or make the RYV canon legit.
    No. As much as some fans feel put out over OMD, most fans don't care. Even if they didn't like the story itself, it didn't destroy Spider-Man's history. And there's been ten more years of history added on to the character since then. So, no, the endless butthurt some fans feel over OMD doesn't override the fact that time has moved on for most everyone else.

  10. #10
    Astonishing Member theoneandonly's Avatar
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    perhaps RYV and OMD peter should merge.
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  11. #11
    Astonishing Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    A total reboot would be the only situation that I would read ASM. (A total reversal of OMD would also do it, but between the fact that Marvel has promised us that will "never" happen and the fact that I don't trust them after OMD, I don't see that happening). Now, do I think that a reboot will happen? No. ASM as is sells too well to make it worth their while and it's too well integrated into the whole 616 publishing line. They'd have to do a wholesale reboot across the line and I don't see that happening.

    Frankly, I think post-2007 ASM is a lost cause at this point. Best to leave it as is and pursue our Spider-Man habits through other means.
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  12. #12
    Moderator oldschool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Warren View Post
    Are you kidding? Because you, personally, don't like the direction of the book or the character, Marvel needs to reboot it? Give me a break.

    Also, every single character in comics could be accused of not having "forward thrust" because they don't progress the way real people do. All characters that exist in a shared universe operate under an "illusion of change." Should they all be rebooted?

    Did you read what I wrote? I said I don't think it should be rebooted, personally. And I just asked the question of what everyone else thinks, not that I think Marvel should or shouldn't do something based on my personal like or dislike. Lastly, I think Spidey suffers from the "illusion of change" more than other characters due to editorial jerking him back and forth between differing ages and tones. Batman, by way of comparison, has stayed fairly true to the same tone for decades now.
    I miss Kevin Nichols. Not as much as bacon, but still...

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Frankly, we should be discussing whether it's time for a second hard reboot. The time for a hard reboot was twenty years ago.

    I feel like continuity is a bit like a hard drive. It's going to get cluttered up and unwieldy. And eventually defragmenting it is no longer enough.

    20-30 years feels like the right length for a run unless continuity isn't that important to your character.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    20-30 years feels like the right length for a run unless continuity isn't that important to your character.
    In that case, we should probably expect a reboot of The Simpsons any moment now. Since they're close to 30 years.

    Spider-Man is at risk of becoming just like that show too. A zombie franchise.

  15. #15
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    I don't know, on one hand there have been plenty of retcons and the like to the point cleanup might be necessary...

    On the other hand, I think they will go the Ultimate route and keep Peter a teenager perpetually if they were to reboot in this day and age... So I don't know if he would be allowed to grow if they started him off in high school again.

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