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  1. #16
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    Well, that's not actually a problem if he is using things like sonic and smoke grenades that he's insulated against.

    Non-bloodlusted, Nightcrawler has been out fought on pure skill before, and all Dick really needs to do is endure punches long enough to start unloading from the belt.

    Bloodlusted, Kurt should kill Dick with the opening move.

  2. #17
    Fantastic Member Morning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    If Dick throws anything,it's liable to get ported so that it ends up hitting him in the back of the head.
    I meant by throwing it at the ground, or just setting them off in his hand. Kurt still needs to see to aim his teleports right?

  3. #18
    Prince of Duckness Beadle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning View Post
    I meant by throwing it at the ground, or just setting them off in his hand. Kurt still needs to see to aim his teleports right?
    No, he has to be able to visualise. Not the same thing. Well, technically he doesn’t even need to do that, but he won’t port without being able to visualise where he’s finishing so he doesn’t end up porting into a wall or something and dying.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beadle View Post
    No, he has to be able to visualise. Not the same thing. Well, technically he doesnít even need to do that, but he wonít port without being able to visualise where heís finishing so he doesnít end up porting into a wall or something and dying.
    Is that even an issue for him anymore, now that he can apparently resurrect himself by teleporting out of the afterlife or something?

  5. #20
    Prince of Duckness Beadle's Avatar
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    Oh, lord knows. I haven’t picked up a comic in about 7 years, so I don’t have a clue.

  6. #21
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    Are the swords standard equipment for Kurt? Not that he needs them.

  7. #22
    Fantastic Member Morning's Avatar
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    But what is there in the arena to visualize except for nightwing, who won’t be standing still waiting to be ported on, especially since he’ll be in a cloud of vision-impairing smoke as quickly as possible? I'm not saying it will stop him from porting, just stop him from aiming it well.

    Kurt’s insta-kill options require high teleporting accuracy against a target he can easily locate. So all Dick has to do is survive the opening second (which, given his reflexes and skill, maybe, right?) before his gear gives him a fighting chance?
    Last edited by Morning; 11-14-2017 at 07:32 PM.

  8. #23
    Astonishing Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning View Post
    But what is there in the arena to visualize except for nightwing, who won’t be standing still waiting to be ported on, especially since he’ll be in a cloud of vision-impairing smoke as quickly as possible?

    Kurt’s insta-kill options require high teleporting accuracy against a target he can easily locate. So all Dick has to do is survive the opening second (which, given his reflexes and skill, maybe, right?) before his gear gives him a fighting chance?
    He actually visualizes locations rather than people, so the answer would be "every square inch of the arena that Nightwing isn't currently occupying." Though ISTR that he can teleport into the Astral Plane or something, but I'm not sure if there weren't some sort of extenuating circumstances involved and I don't think that's really useful against anyone who isn't a telepath.

  9. #24
    Fantastic Member Morning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Drunkard Kid View Post
    He actually visualizes locations rather than people, so the answer would be "every square inch of the arena that Nightwing isn't currently occupying." Though ISTR that he can teleport into the Astral Plane or something, but I'm not sure if there weren't some sort of extenuating circumstances involved and I don't think that's really useful against anyone who isn't a telepath.
    My point is that no square inch of the basically empty arena is going to be useful to visualize except the ones near Nightwing, who will be moving and thus can only be ported to so long as he's visible to Nightcrawler.

  10. #25
    Better than YOU! Alan2099's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning View Post
    But what is there in the arena to visualize except for nightwing, who won’t be standing still waiting to be ported on, especially since he’ll be in a cloud of vision-impairing smoke as quickly as possible? I'm not saying it will stop him from porting, just stop him from aiming it well.

    Kurt’s insta-kill options require high teleporting accuracy against a target he can easily locate. So all Dick has to do is survive the opening second (which, given his reflexes and skill, maybe, right?) before his gear gives him a fighting chance?
    Reflexes, Speed and agility, I'd say they were at least equal with maybe a slight edge to Kurt. Not counting his extra limb and Spider-man like ability to leap insane distances easily.

    Fighting skills? Nightwing is by far a better fighter. However all Kurt has to do is literally touch him.

    As for using his belt ... he's not hitting Nightcralwer with anything he throws. Dick can empty his belt at the guy, but Kurt is just going to be dodging, and teleporting all over the arena until 'Wing doesn't have anything left to throw.

  11. #26
    Astonishing Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning View Post
    My point is that no square inch of the basically empty arena is going to be useful to visualize except the ones near Nightwing, who will be moving and thus can only be ported to so long as he's visible to Nightcrawler.
    I think that being really far away in any random direction within a three dimensional dome at a split-second's notice is really useful against a guy that A) has tons of ranged and AOE weapons on his person, and B) needs to actually exert himself to get into melee range while Kurt can get in and out of range with a thought. Hell, throwing a batarang (nightarang?) at him just means that he will have the opportunity to grab them later on and toss them back to manipulate Dick's movements.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    Reflexes, Speed and agility, I'd say they were at least equal with maybe a slight edge to Kurt. Not counting his extra limb and Spider-man like ability to leap insane distances easily.

    Fighting skills? Nightwing is by far a better fighter. However all Kurt has to do is literally touch him.

    As for using his belt ... he's not hitting Nightcralwer with anything he throws. Dick can empty his belt at the guy, but Kurt is just going to be dodging, and teleporting all over the arena until 'Wing doesn't have anything left to throw.
    Eh... Agility, sure, but I'd like to see feats for Nightcrawler having equal reflexes.

    But he should be fast enough to port, grab, win. Which is all that matters bloodlusted.

  13. #28
    Fantastic Member Morning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alan2099 View Post
    Fighting skills? Nightwing is by far a better fighter. However all Kurt has to do is literally touch him.
    Which is why at the beginning, Dick will have to try to not be touched.

    As for using his belt ... he's not hitting Nightcralwer with anything he throws. Dick can empty his belt at the guy, but Kurt is just going to be dodging, and teleporting all over the arena until 'Wing doesn't have anything left to throw.
    I specifically mentioned gas, flashbangs and sonics because they don't have to be thrown at someone to be effective. Knowing Nightcrawler has to bamf into melee range to attack, Dick could set off an AOE at his own position just using intuition and reflexes to time it right. People will comparable reflexes have been able to react to bamf-attacks before--and even tag Kurt if they can anticipate where he will reappear--so this isn't an impossible counter-attack strategy.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning View Post
    Which is why at the beginning, Dick will have to try to not be touched.
    That's an extremely tall order, even for Nightwing. That's because Nightcrawler has done multi-ports numerous times in the blink of an eye.

    *Bamf* "Oh that's cute, he leapt forward to avoid my punch! Oh and he's reaching for something on his belt!" *Bamf* "Now I'm on his back and grabbing his head" *Bamf* "Ooo, that sounds like a sonic grenade! I bet that would have been painful were I still over there." *drops head of Nightwing on arena floor*

    And that's assuming Dick is fast enough to reach into his belt, grab the specific weapon he wants, and activates it, which considering just how fast Nightcrawler can port attack from different directions, is a slim possibility.

  15. #30
    Fantastic Member Morning's Avatar
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    *Bamf* "Oh that's cute, he leapt forward to avoid my punch! Oh and he's reaching for something on his belt!" *Bamf* "Now I'm on his back and grabbing his head" *Bamf* "Ooo, that sounds like a sonic grenade! I bet that would have been painful were I still over there." *drops head of Nightwing on arena floor*
    So Nightwing's mind is so much faster than Dick's that he can watch him dodge in slow-motion and cooly consider his options; or Dick is so bad at dodging that after successfully reacting to the first attack, he is incapable of dodging any more; or what exactly are you claiming here?

    His current gloves shoot sonic grenades. He doesn't have to reach for, or aim, anything. He also has an AOE attack with his electrified sticks (and an insulated suit). If he can stun Nightcrawler with one of several AOE options long enough to land one clean hit, I think he wins.
    Last edited by Morning; 11-14-2017 at 09:57 PM.

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