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  1. #331
    Seeing RED... Bart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rutog98 View Post
    This doesn't make sense. Cassandra is very obviously a Xavier nemesis moreso than anyone else's. Also, she'd have an even bigger axe to grind with Emma than Jean, I'd say. Emma is the one that trapped her in the Imperial Guardsman, Stuff. Unless somebody on the team has some kind of power that neutralizes psi powers, or has tech abilities that can neutralize psi-powers, or have enormous psychic defenses that Nova can't break through, Cassandra is not a threat this team can handle by itself. They would need somebody like Emma to work together with Jean to try and beat Nova or maybe Xavier swoops in and save the day by himself. Jean is nowhere near strong enough a psi character to take on Nova alone without some serious PIS being used to weaken Cassandra. On the other hand, without another psi like Xavier or Emma lending a hand, it would be interesting to see how this team overcomes the villain. They would have to trick her or something and ambush her before she can attack their minds to take her down.

    I'm almost tempted to pick up this story arc only for Cassandra Nova, but I'm likely not.
    Thank you for taking the time from your prolific Storm and the X-Men fan fiction to comment on Jean's team book.

    If you had actually read it, you'd see that Jean's goals and actions directly interfere with Nova's plans. In addition to Jean foiling her entire plan the first time, she's definitely being set up as Jean's nemesis and the team villain.

    Again Jean will never be a "strong enough psi character" for you because everything she does you attribute to PIS. But somehow for others it sets a new standard for them. So I don't want to get into that issue with you here.

  2. #332
    Mighty Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sundowhn View Post
    I absolutely love these two working together. I agree, it makes sense that they should be close friends because of similarities in outlook. This is my favorite scene from the book.

    Their friendship was touched on, in a different way, in Remender's revisit to AOA during his UXF run. (AoA)Jean and Kurt were in Atlantis with the remnants of the X-Men, but that world's version were very different characters -- jaded and wounded. The 616 guys still have hope.
    Unless we're missing something, I don't know how Jean's plan is "beautiful" enough to bring Nightcrawler to tears.

    Quote Originally Posted by 5cents View Post
    This book is doing what it’s suppose to do. Get people interested and talking. I hope it sparks some interesting debates/talk but I hope it stays respectful.
    I think the majority of the posters here have been good about keeping things civil, even when delicate topics have been brought up. It's nice. I'd love to pick up the book today, but payday isn't until tomorrow. I'll be sure to give my full thoughts on it once I've read the issue.

  3. #333
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    This is not even accurate. The PA and even Hamas have accepted the 1960 borders however Israel are currently illegally occupying land under international law where they also have control over food, sea, air and the borders pg Gaza and the West bank.

    At present they are annexing more and more land under the pretence pf a two state solution. Additionally, within Israel there is a two tier system (apartheid system) where Arab Israelis in jeresulalam do not have the right to vote in muncipality elections. Anyone who is non Jewish cannot rent or buy housing in certain areas as well. Additionally, there are camps where african refugees are detained. And their human rights in fringed. Israel also enjoys close friendships with Arab Nations such as Egypt and Saudia Arabia. Due to the seige on Gaza the UN have declared it uninhabitable. Israel are Also currently occupying the Golan heights illegally by international law.

    I realize the USA is like one of the last countries in the world that still conflates Zionism with Judaism. But they are not ssynonymous. Israel is not for a two state solution. They used that as a guide to annex more and more land. As a one state they can either choose to be a secular state where both parties live together and have equal rights and allow refugees the right of return under the declaration of human rights. Which by the way they do not want. Or they can wipe out Palestine and take all the land which is what they are currently doing


    Yogaflame is the voice of reason in a sea of ignorance

    There's also a difference between the sephradic Jewish people who are cousins of the Palestinians in Israel and the European ones who are generally lighter skinned and the ones who have control over the government.
    No they haven't.

    "Hamas considers the establishment of a Palestinian state, sovereign and complete, on the basis of the June 4, 1967, with Jerusalem as its capital and the provision for all the refugees to return to their homeland is an agreeable form that has won a consensus among all the movement members,"

    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/0...114309725.html

    The 1967 War was fought beginning on June 5, 1967. What Hamas and PA have accepted is the line before the war started which would include East Jerusalem which they want to be the capital of a Palestinian state. I said Israel wants to keep the land they claimed as a result of both wars which means it would be the line after the war ended June 10, 1967. That end included Israel claiming ALL of Jerusalem and parts of West Bank, Gaza, etc.

    Jerusalem is the main sticking point because Israel wants it all but the Palestinians want East Jerusalem hence why they say they will accept the 4th June 1967 land. Jerusalem is one of the 3 Holy sites in Islam so Palestinians are unlikely to give it all up like Israel wants. Israel's position is they won the war and they get the victor's share which would included ALL of Jerusalem not just the parts of it they controlled on June 4, 1967.

    I never commented on any of the other stuff you mentioned as I already said Israel has committed its own crimes and atrocities.
    Last edited by remydat; 02-08-2018 at 10:54 AM.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  4. #334
    Mighty Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bart View Post
    Thank you for taking the time from your prolific Storm and the X-Men fan fiction to comment on Jean's team book.

    If you had actually read it, you'd see that Jean's goals and actions directly interfere with Nova's plans. In addition to Jean foiling her entire plan the first time, she's definitely being set up as Jean's nemesis and the team villain.

    Again Jean will never be a "strong enough psi character" for you because everything she does you attribute to PIS. But somehow for others it sets a new standard for them. So I don't want to get into that issue with you here.
    Agreed. Jean might not have foiled her plans during Morrison's run single-handedly, but she foiled her biggest goal by saving Xavier. That's likely to give her an ax to grind with Jean.

    As for Emma, didn't Nova already play a part in Whedon's Astonishing run? I think it's fine to leave it at that.

  5. #335
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    The 1967 borders. Also known as the Auschwitz borders. And “international law” is BS. The UN lets some of the worst countries on Earth govern its trash organization. It’s existance is laughable. And the two-state solution (which has been rejected by the Palestinians every single time) is a total sham. Why would we want another terrorist state? Besides, they hold no historical claim and the contested land was won in a defensive war. And anti-Zionism is antisemitism. Plain and simple. The former is just a new term people use to make it seem like they’re not giant bigots.
    Which has been sabotaged by Israel at every turn. International law is BS really? Under international law uii cannot take land won in war.

    And the fact that you list Linda sarsour and Chomsky as radicals is laughable. Demanding the self determination of the Palestinian people is basic humanity. And yet happily defend the actions of netanyahu. The brainwashing is very strong here.
    Last edited by ExodusCloak; 02-08-2018 at 10:55 AM.

  6. #336
    Seeing RED... Bart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jean Grey View Post
    I think Cassandra is going to get her ass kicked by Jean in order to establish Jean's power level sans Phoenix. Cassandra making note of Jean being not the Phoenix was too obvious of a giveaway imo.
    I want to see Jean kick her in her wrinkled head. I love Cassandra Nova because every time she shows up, you know nastiness is going to go down. She's a true terror.

  7. #337
    hate cant reach you here Endsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hizashi View Post
    Unless we're missing something, I don't know how Jean's plan is "beautiful" enough to bring Nightcrawler to tears.
    You are missing something, though. Kurt saw and felt Jean's dream as it was realized. He saw it without all of the kinks. He saw it in action through her telepathy. We only read about it, her telling us what it was, and working to get it going.

    "I've never felt the world so angry. So divided. I can hear you. I can hear your pain. Your fear. Your anxiety. I want to help. I don't know how, but I'll learn." - X-Men Red #1(2018)

  8. #338
    Super Moderator Tenebrae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hizashi View Post
    Unless we're missing something, I don't know how Jean's plan is "beautiful" enough to bring Nightcrawler to tears.
    Seeing something telepathically would probably involve feeling emotions and whatnot. Seems logical the feeling would be intense.

  9. #339
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by remydat View Post
    No they haven't.

    "Hamas considers the establishment of a Palestinian state, sovereign and complete, on the basis of the June 4, 1967, with Jerusalem as its capital and the provision for all the refugees to return to their homeland is an agreeable form that has won a consensus among all the movement members,"

    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/0...114309725.html

    The 1967 War was fought beginning on June 5, 1967. What Hamas and PA have accepted is the line before the war started which would include East Jerusalem which they want to be the capital of a Palestinian state. I said Israel wants to keep the land they claimed as a result of both wars which means it would be the line after the war ended June 10, 1967. That end included Israel claiming ALL of Jerusalem.

    Jerusalem is the main sticking point because Israel wants it all but the Palestinians want East Jerusalem hence why they say they will accept the 4th June 1967 land. Jerusalem is one of the 3 Holy sites in Islam so Palestinians are unlikely to give it all up like Israel wants.

    I never commented on any of the other stuff you mentioned as I already said Israel has committed its own crimes and atrocities.
    https://www.google.ie/amp/www.aljaze...114309725.html

    Yes they have it was already de ided that Jeresulalam would be split and that's current international consensus. And under international consensus three is no peace agreement otherwise and Israel will isolate itself from the rest of the world just like apartheid south Africa
    Last edited by ExodusCloak; 02-08-2018 at 10:57 AM.

  10. #340
    hate cant reach you here Endsong's Avatar
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    Okay, but no offense guys... maybe take the political talk to PM?

    "I've never felt the world so angry. So divided. I can hear you. I can hear your pain. Your fear. Your anxiety. I want to help. I don't know how, but I'll learn." - X-Men Red #1(2018)

  11. #341
    Senior Master DDM's Avatar
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    Jean’s Dream is the new Cyclops’ Revolution. IE: nothing but an empty plot point to move shit around. At least Scott didn’t have to telepathically steal his idea from his betters though.

    Kurt probably cried from the futility of it all.

  12. #342
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExodusCloak View Post
    https://www.google.ie/amp/www.aljaze...114309725.html

    Yes they have it was already de ided that Jeresulalam would be split and that's current international consensus
    I never argued about international consensus. I said Israel wants to keep the land it won in the wars. The land they won in the 6 day war includes all of Jerusalem. This is historical fact.

    The June 19 Israeli cabinet decision did not include the Gaza Strip, and left open the possibility of Israel permanently acquiring parts of the West Bank. On June 25–27, Israel incorporated East Jerusalem together with areas of the West Bank to the north and south into Jerusalem's new municipal boundaries.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

    I am not debating that Israel is right. I am telling you Palestinians and Israel still disagree on borders because Palestinians want the borders at 4 June 1967. Israel wants borders after they won the Six Day War. In any event, we can take to PM so as not to disrupt the thread.
    Last edited by remydat; 02-08-2018 at 11:02 AM.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  13. #343
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDM View Post
    Jean’s Dream is the new Cyclops’ Revolution. IE: nothing but an empty plot point to move shit around. At least Scott didn’t have to telepathically steal his idea from his betters though.

    Kurt probably cried from the futility of it all.
    Cyclops staged a peaceful protest outside Washington with every mutant on the planet. I think the story will be about clearing her name rather then the "nation" idea

  14. #344
    hate cant reach you here Endsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDM View Post
    Jean’s Dream is the new Cyclops’ Revolution. IE: nothing but an empty plot point to move shit around. At least Scott didn’t have to telepathically steal his idea from his betters though.

    Kurt probably cried from the futility of it all.
    Nah; you can keep hating all you want but I think it's clear that Marvel actually wants to do something with this. Otherwise they would have gotten Bendis or Guggenheim to write this, too, instead of a competent creator.

    "I've never felt the world so angry. So divided. I can hear you. I can hear your pain. Your fear. Your anxiety. I want to help. I don't know how, but I'll learn." - X-Men Red #1(2018)

  15. #345
    Extraordinary Member ExodusCloak's Avatar
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    I assume Kurt is going to be the friend that becomes her enemy? through mind control?

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