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  1. #31
    Notorious M.O.S. Kuwagaton's Avatar
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    Good point from Jim that it's just easy to draw people around the table. We've seen many scenes like this and yeah, what they go for is usually either completely random or a joke. No one would find it odd for Clark or Superman unless it's something noted that they have in common, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfly Frankenstein View Post
    Four words...Beef Bourguignon with Ketchup...
    Three other words: Big Belly Burger. But there's nothing that can replace the classic #454 cover:


  2. #32
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    I feel like this thread kind of proved my original point. When people think Superman is moving away from where they stand on things there's a sort of panicky emotion that rise out of them. I eat meat therefore so should Superman. He's a guy that's experienced tons of things from different corners of the universe and reality. Why would he be like you anymore than anyone else on Earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trunks View Post



    He is a kryptonian,but he was raisied completely on Earth with a awesome set of common Sense parents,so no he isn't going to look at stuff he spent his whole life thinking is normal in some weird alien way.
    Like this. This thing where Clark is basically just some kind of extension of the Kent's is so utterly dull, leaves no room for further development. Who are these people that know only the things their parents told them and nothing else. Especially a guy like Supes who goes on all sort of adventures?
    Last edited by The World; 05-18-2018 at 01:57 PM.
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  3. #33
    Mighty Member Uncanny Mutie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Hunter View Post
    Because after a hard day of saving the world the man just wants to eat a burger and chill like 95% of people are want to do.
    I was going to say, "Because it was stupid," but this is an even better answer...lol.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by RudHao View Post
    Because in a world where something like "The Green" exists behind all plant life it's a dumb as hell to say that eating animals ls wrong but eating plants is a ok. Ask Swamp Thing how he feels about that, it would give Poison Ivy a good reason to ch o after Supes if they went that route though....
    This is a good point... ALL life is sacred, not just the cute and fuzzy. Superman doesn't need to eat period. I would ask why people care so much, but alas...

  5. #35
    Spectacular Member Trunks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The World View Post
    I feel like this thread kind of proved my original point. When people think Superman is moving away from where they stand on things there's a sort of panicky emotion that rise out of them. I eat meat therefore so should Superman. He's a guy that's experienced tons of things from different corners of the universe and reality. Why would he be like you anymore than anyone else on Earth?



    Like this. This thing where Clark is basically just some kind of extension of the Kent's is so utterly dull, leaves no room for further development. Who are these people that know only the things their parents told them and nothing else. Especially a guy like Supes who goes on all sort of adventures?

    Me and Clark had very different upbringings so it's not about me,it's about 80 years of stories about HIM,and the fact that some think it's "cool" or "about time" he changes,even in nonsensical or opposite of what we have seen for those 80 years

    If you don't like a character the way they are there are a million and a half more for you to choose from that might work with your "gotta change things just to change things" approach.

  6. #36
    Incredible Member Lokimaru's Avatar
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    The very Fact Clark grew up on a farm would mean he grew up intimately connected with the Circle of life and would be OK with Death since it's just another part of Life so him being a Vegan all of a sudden is the very height of Bullshit since Meat tastes good and wouldn't adversely affect him anyway so why make a big deal out of it.

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    From what I understand, the idea came from one of Elliot S! Maggin's novels. In it, he showed Clark being able to see the "souls" of living creatures. So Waid took this and kind of ran with it to what he assumed was the next level. If you can see a living creatures "soul" then that would make it all that much harder to eat it. They kind of did something similar with WW. She could talk to animals so it didn't make a lot of sense for her to eat them. In terms of why it didn't stick and the outrage over it, yeah, I can see why they would drop it after BR didn't take off. In the years since, a lot of fans have since admitted their hatred for the book stemmed mostly from the fact that it replaced MOS and not necessarily the story itself. But when I first started going to the DC message boards circa 2006, the hate on for BR was still pretty strong.
    Listen, lady! I am thirteen years old and driving a Bat-hog through the Amazon on a Tuesday morning! I am ALREADY winning!

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  8. #38
    Amazing Member Flashback's Avatar
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    The question was why it didn't stick, not that DC should change Superman to a Vegan today.

    To answer the question, it's because it would have isolated readers. People "tend" to find vegetarians weird, "meats so good, why choose not to eat it" and as someone mentioned comic fans like it when they share similarities with their favorite characters. Even something like a simple quirk or idiosyncrasy.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trunks View Post
    Me and Clark had very different upbringings so it's not about me,it's about 80 years of stories about HIM,and the fact that some think it's "cool" or "about time" he changes,even in nonsensical or opposite of what we have seen for those 80 years

    If you don't like a character the way they are there are a million and a half more for you to choose from that might work with your "gotta change things just to change things" approach.
    Guy we're talking about Superman not some character that was briefly written in the early 40's and then recently got a revival. The character we have today IS because of change. In fact what was it you said before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trunks View Post
    Or it could be because he was raised on a farm and powerless for years and killing and eating animals for food was the norm.
    A nice meaty chunk of those 80 years says no.



    The only reason we even believe that Superman grew up powerless is because a writer at one point was allowed to make it so because Superman was considered in need of changing.
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  10. #40
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The World View Post
    Guy we're talking about Superman not some character that was briefly written in the early 40's and then recently got a revival. The character we have today IS because of change. In fact what was it you said before.



    A nice meaty chunk of those 80 years says no.



    The only reason we even believe that Superman grew up powerless is because a writer at one point was allowed to make it so because Superman was considered in need of changing.
    Any chance we could just go back to this origin and move on?
    Listen, lady! I am thirteen years old and driving a Bat-hog through the Amazon on a Tuesday morning! I am ALREADY winning!

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  11. #41
    Incredible Member kingaliencracker's Avatar
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    I think the issue was that it made Superman take somewhat of a political stance and it made it seem like those who weren't vegetarians or vegans were somehow in the wrong.

    May seem silly but that was the issue I remember at the time.

  12. #42
    Astonishing Member superduperman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuwagaton View Post
    Good point from Jim that it's just easy to draw people around the table. We've seen many scenes like this and yeah, what they go for is usually either completely random or a joke. No one would find it odd for Clark or Superman unless it's something noted that they have in common, I think.



    Three other words: Big Belly Burger. But there's nothing that can replace the classic #454 cover:

    Talk about fast food! (I'll see myself out)
    Listen, lady! I am thirteen years old and driving a Bat-hog through the Amazon on a Tuesday morning! I am ALREADY winning!

    -Robin

  13. #43
    Obsessed & Compelled Bored at 3:00AM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingaliencracker View Post
    I think the issue was that it made Superman take somewhat of a political stance and it made it seem like those who weren't vegetarians or vegans were somehow in the wrong.

    May seem silly but that was the issue I remember at the time.
    I think you've hit the nail on the head here. The irony of course being that the early Superman stories were incredibly political until editorial systematically started shaving down the rougher edges to make him appeal to as large an audience as possible without offending anybody and "the American Way" got tacked on to the end of his "Truth & Justice" raison d'etre. That said, even then we had Superman quite openly coming out against prejudice and discrimination based upon race, gender or ethnicity, which, by today's insane standards, would no doubt brand Superman as a radical leftist

    It is pretty ridiculous that the idea of a fictional character making a personal decision to not eat meat is somehow a political statement that people feel threatened by. Why would you need to feel threatened by someone not eating meat? Yes, it can be annoying in reality when a group of people are ordering a pizza and the one vegetarian insists on an entire vegetarian pizza that nobody else wants, but this isn't that in the slightest. It's being consistent with principles that have been laid down for a fictional character, who has consistently been shown to go out of his way to not take the life of any creature of various species. The idea of a guy like that being okay with eating a cow doesn't really track for me, even though I personally have no problem eating a cow because cows are dumb as dirt and are delicious

  14. #44
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    I think it would be funny if Superman craved rocks and minerals, which for his body chemistry might make more sense.

  15. #45
    Spectacular Member Robanker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trunks View Post
    Or it could be because he was raised on a farm and powerless for years and killing and eating animals for food was the norm.

    He wouldn't actively kill anything,but he won't say no to food.
    I think he'd eat meat with friends or family if that's what they had at the table, but on his own he probably would stick to produce. I remember in Justice Society of America he was trying to tell Starman he didn't eat meat, but Thom couldn't figure out what he was saying and earnestly offered Clark a sloppy joe again, to which he accepted. If he and Lois went out to dinner, I'd imagine he'd eat off the vegetarian or vegen menu, but if she or a friend cooked burgers at home, that'd be okay too. I just can't imagine Clark being too fussy about what he eats, preferences aside.

    I don't think his early life in Kansas defines him entirely, but the time on the farm and among other farmers and good, decent people (as Smallville is generally depicted to be comprised of) has taught him the cycle of life and that being an omnivore isn't a moral choice. It's a part of Earth's ecosystem. While he would applaud someone of taking a more humane approach to it and choosing to be a vegetarian, I doubt he looks at others as lesser for eating meat. The Kents are his high-water mark for human ethical behavior and they most certainly ate meat.

    Why it fell out? Birthright just didn't stick, and this item in particular likely because it made Clark seem less "alpha," for lack of a better term. That and, as suggested, perhaps his status as a symbol of what we could be, a man of tomorrow, it implied that eating meat was something we need to overcome in our evolution; that on some level, it's wrong. I know some would ardently defend eating animal flesh and others vehemently defend it, but the truth is somewhere in the middle. There's a more nuanced answer for humans who have evolved into omnivores over thousands of years. That goes for Clark too.
    Last edited by Robanker; 05-19-2018 at 02:52 AM.

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