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  1. #76
    Astonishing Member Tazpocalapse's Avatar
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    I will definitely check out the Bobby bishop story. I always liked the Banter those 2 had in X-men Gold. I hope Sina can add that comedic level the 2 had in this story.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    This is absolutely insane and proves that Marvel cares nothing of profit anymore.
    It definitely proves that fans who obsess over the Diamond figures every month don't know the actual workings of the industry at all.

    I didn't care about this book when it came out and I don't care about it now but I'm happy for the fans who have an interest in it.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    If Iceman and Wasp can get another solo, there’s literally no reason any book can’t be relaunched.
    I would say Dc's Cyborg makes a bigger case for that than Iceman.

    Everybody including the WORST of Marvel has beaten that book be it trade, floppy or digital.

    This is absolutely insane and proves that Marvel cares nothing of profit anymore.
    If they were going to relaunch Iceman I would have preferred a new writer.
    Amazon sales say different.

    I think this says Marvel is looking beyond the comic book store. This is the point Prof Warren has been trying to make. Marvel has access to way more data and that comic book store orders are not the end all that so many want it to be.
    So who is Marvel suppose to listen to? Comic book stores and that echo chamber? Or the folks who have put their money where their mouths are (at least with trades) and bought the books?

    It looks like they are listening to the buyers. If this means another 8 issues and 2 trades-hey that means 4 trades starring Bobby. A LOT of guys can't boast that.

  4. #79

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    It makes sense that this book was purchased more in auxiliary markets than in comic book stores. Just sayin'.

  5. #80
    BAMF!!!!! KurtW95's Avatar
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    We have seen Bobby’s pure, unfiltered thoughts for 50 years. He has repeatedly shown his attraction to women. Bendis’ explanation that he chose to subdue his gayness because it was hard enough to be a mutant. His literal origin where he discovers his powers was when he was on a date with a girl. He had was already dating girls before he knew he was a mutant. And Scott Lobdell has said that he wrote Bobby as straight in the 90s. So, people can point to that, but it’s refuted by the writer. LikeI said before though, I have no problem showcasing gay characters. Bobby just isn’t one. Northstar has potential, but they kind of turned him into a stereotype as well. Northstar was created gay, but has unfortunately been relegated to the background and talking like a stereotype. John Byrne Northstar would never yell “Go team Jacob!” while fighting vampires. He should be an aggressive, overconfident, gay French Canadian.
    Good Marvel characters- Bring Them Back!!!

  6. #81
    Bishop was right. Sighphi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyvolt2000 View Post

    Amazon sales say different.

    I think this says Marvel is looking beyond the comic book store. This is the point Prof Warren has been trying to make. Marvel has access to way more data and that comic book store orders are not the end all that so many want it to be.
    So who is Marvel suppose to listen to? Comic book stores and that echo chamber? Or the folks who have put their money where their mouths are (at least with trades) and bought the books?

    It looks like they are listening to the buyers. If this means another 8 issues and 2 trades-hey that means 4 trades starring Bobby. A LOT of guys can't boast that.
    One would think that if sales are that great they would be celebrating that. And surely using that as part of the promotion of the book.

    It strange that these books sell low at stores but it's the opposite everywhere else.

  7. #82

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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    John Byrne Northstar would never yell “Go team Jacob!” while fighting vampires. He should be an aggressive, overconfident French Canadian.
    And an FLQ terrorist!

  8. #83
    Astonishing Member TheCape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blanchett View Post
    I wasn't crazy about Sina Grace's Iceman run. It wasn't what I wanted but it was hardly terrible and had some good points.

    What I still don't get even some people didn't see it, Iceman seemed super gay to me long before he came out. Like when I was reading back in the 90s. I knew. He just didn't know. That's a lot of people's experience with this character. I get you didn't see it that way, the subtext may not have been intentional but there was so much of it, it was no a random choice having him come out.

    It was just badly done.
    Subtext is a complicate thing to disscuss in fiction, specially because every fan doesn't interpret things in the same way (my profile picture is a good example of that ). Now speaking for me, i've never been a fan of Iceman (not a hater, just never been into him as a characther), when i find about his reveal i thougth that it was silly, but i was a dumb teenager that didn't know much about how people discover their sexuality, looking to some of the scenes and issues i could see the interpretation that Bobby was gay and simply wasn't aware of it, but you also could argue that he was just afraid of commitment like many young men that aren't sure where they want to go with their lifes, both interpretations were valid IMHO. At the end it was revealed that he was and after gaining some understanding of how it coming out works, i had no problem with it, in spite of being executed poorly by Bendis.
    Last edited by TheCape; 06-13-2018 at 03:21 PM.

  9. #84

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    "Iceman wasn't created gay!"

    As if the same homophobia that we should work against today had no role in that.
    Last edited by Strong Girl Daken; 06-13-2018 at 03:18 PM.

  10. #85
    Incredible Member Skedatz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sighphi View Post
    One would think that if sales are that great they would be celebrating that. And surely using that as part of the promotion of the book.

    It strange that these books sell low at stores but it's the opposite everywhere else.
    "Buy our book. Everybody else did!"

    That actually would be on a Byrne She-Hulk cover. lol
    Last edited by Skedatz; 06-13-2018 at 03:25 PM.

  11. #86
    Fantastic Member silence.'s Avatar
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    I'm so happy! I was heartbroken when it was taken away. I loved the book

  12. #87
    ...of the Black Priests Midnight_v's Avatar
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    This is actually an amazingly unexpected move by marvel.
    I find the move to relaunch the book with the same writer refreshingly fetch, and determined.
    Hopefully, it finds the same kind of success Carol got with the most recent Captain Marvel relaunch. Interesting times to be a comics fan. *cheers*
    My priority is enjoying and supporting stories of timeless heroism and conflict.
    Everything else is irrelevant.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sighphi View Post
    It strange that these books sell low at stores but it's the opposite everywhere else.
    no its not strange, comic stores are lagging behind in being consumer friendly(not to mention there a a few stores were the owner and other customer will judge you for what you buy) and there are places that lack a store or its too far to get to, digital is becoming a better platform. not to mention if i can carry the dozens of comics digital on a phone to read anywhere or buy a trade for $1 without getting out of bead why would i go to a store?. As of now the only insentive for physial over digital is virent covers(and that depends on the app, DC comic app has the varients covers with digital comics). digital is easer to buy,carry,and recover and will more offen then not be more accurate to the want of a comic then physical.

  14. #89
    Fantastic Member blanchett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KurtW95 View Post
    We have seen Bobby’s pure, unfiltered thoughts for 50 years. He has repeatedly shown his attraction to women. Bendis’ explanation that he chose to subdue his gayness because it was hard enough to be a mutant. His literal origin where he discovers his powers was when he was on a date with a girl. He had was already dating girls before he knew he was a mutant. And Scott Lobdell has said that he wrote Bobby as straight in the 90s. So, people can point to that, but it’s refuted by the writer. LikeI said before though, I have no problem showcasing gay characters. Bobby just isn’t one. Northstar has potential, but they kind of turned him into a stereotype as well. Northstar was created gay, but has unfortunately been relegated to the background and talking like a stereotype. John Byrne Northstar would never yell “Go team Jacob!” while fighting vampires. He should be an aggressive, overconfident, gay French Canadian.
    I do understand why this retcon bothers people. I do. But if no one at all saw it, it would be one thing. A lot of us saw Iceman as closeted. It wasn't random. Kurt coming out would feel random. Beast, Colossus, pretty much everyone else. Iceman, just no.

    Anecdotally my former house was married to a man for years. She didn't know she was gay. In her words she married the best man she ever met and just couldn't make it work because of her sexuality. Total denial. She's was in her early 30s when she came out. Some people find it harder because they want the conventional life. That was actually one of my issues with Sina Grace's run. I thought Bobby being closeted at this point in life was on him, not on his folks. I thought the blame was too much shifted on the parents when I thought it was about Bobby himself not them.

  15. #90
    Incredible Member Hi-Fi's Avatar
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