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  1. #1081
    Astonishing Member Crimz's Avatar
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    I likely posted this before, but I don't care. I love this artwork



    art by Adam Archer

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  2. #1082
    Incredible Member Oberon's Avatar
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    Sometimes I think there is selective memory with various writers or artists on Sue and her abilities.

    Back around # 190, when Molecule Man had 'possessed' Reed Richards, he/they said Sue's FF had no true molecular 'being'. (think) which implied, strictly energy.

    Now that was in the late '70s or so, before more science or physics has either proved that possible or not.

    But the various things that helped her or changed her. A few days ago we talked about the head set Reed had her wear around the # early 20s. I mentioned the adapted 'Thunder Horn' from the late # 150s. Both of these things were said to increase her ability (in the former, it may have jump-started it?)

    Sue's age was 'reset' to be slightly younger than 'before' during the #210-ish conclusion to Skrulls vs Xandarian arc (one of my favorites, actually) because when Reed managed to adjust the aging ray used on them, he said so or implied that each of them, He, Ben and Sue would all tweak back to before their current age, with Sue, being younger than he and Ben, would tweak back more.

    I'm sure there were other things.

    I love Sue standing alone to an enraged Hulk. She is not afraid of him. (I loved her Malice-influenced playing chicken with the Hulk during the Infinity War/crossover somewhere during Defalco run I think. She was so bad-ass.

  3. #1083
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    Sometimes I think there is selective memory with various writers or artists on Sue and her abilities.

    Back around # 190, when Molecule Man had 'possessed' Reed Richards, he/they said Sue's FF had no true molecular 'being'. (think) which implied, strictly energy.

    Now that was in the late '70s or so, before more science or physics has either proved that possible or not.
    The field having a physical non-energy component bothers me. The original explanation in issue 22 (Stan Lee in the early sixties, I know, unscientific) is that the invisible energy somehow was responsible for the force fields. But Sue's invisibility is all about energy and light. It makes sense to me that her force fields should be energy based as well even if the feel solid. But that's just my thoughts after falling asleep watching shows on dark matter and dark energy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    I love Sue standing alone to an enraged Hulk. She is not afraid of him. (I loved her Malice-influenced playing chicken with the Hulk during the Infinity War/crossover somewhere during Defalco run I think. She was so bad-ass.
    I felt bad for Hulk, there. It's my belief Sue's got the guts of Ben. As many times as we've seen Ben refusing to give up (it's a cliche), Sue's often in similar situations but it's not as trademark as Ben.

  4. #1084
    Latverian ambassador Iron Maiden's Avatar
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    It's been way to long for the Marvel Comics to without their First Lady. I hope that gets addressed this year.
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    My old SuperHero Squad name: Steel Divine Duke

  5. #1085
    Astonishing Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    Sometimes I think there is selective memory with various writers or artists on Sue and her abilities.

    Back around # 190, when Molecule Man had 'possessed' Reed Richards, he/they said Sue's FF had no true molecular 'being'. (think) which implied, strictly energy.

    Now that was in the late '70s or so, before more science or physics has either proved that possible or not.

    But the various things that helped her or changed her. A few days ago we talked about the head set Reed had her wear around the # early 20s. I mentioned the adapted 'Thunder Horn' from the late # 150s. Both of these things were said to increase her ability (in the former, it may have jump-started it?)

    Sue's age was 'reset' to be slightly younger than 'before' during the #210-ish conclusion to Skrulls vs Xandarian arc (one of my favorites, actually) because when Reed managed to adjust the aging ray used on them, he said so or implied that each of them, He, Ben and Sue would all tweak back to before their current age, with Sue, being younger than he and Ben, would tweak back more.

    I'm sure there were other things.

    I love Sue standing alone to an enraged Hulk. She is not afraid of him. (I loved her Malice-influenced playing chicken with the Hulk during the Infinity War/crossover somewhere during Defalco run I think. She was so bad-ass.
    The way I viewed that statement regarding the force field, is that while the field is solid due to the energy being present to create it, the molecules were constantly shifting at light speed. The dotted lines used to represent the force field also helped me believe that-- they were there but not solid like a chair or book. I Hope that makes sense.

  6. #1086
    Incredible Member Oberon's Avatar
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    As I can remember, the field is energy, or said to be. But nearly unbreakable. Sue has survived, saved others from Nuclear blasts/other

    vacuums in space, Thor's hammer, (once?) etc. etc. They never un-cannoned Nathaniel's statement that she could pierce Celestial armor with it -

    which almost implies that it is one energy against the other perhaps?

  7. #1087
    Astonishing Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Nathaniel said it was Hyperspace energy - energy from the same plane as the Celestials. That likely explains why she can harm them and probably why she can block so many crazy things.

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  8. #1088
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    Sue's not like the other FF members. the other three have had changes happen to their bodies. Their powers arise because of their changed bodies. Reed is stretchy, Johnny's fire, and Ben's a rock dude. Sue, OTOH, ruens herself and other items invisible. becaise she can turn other things invisible makes me think her power is warping light or using mental abilities to actually make matter invisible. her body hasn't been changed for her powers, it's her mind that can adjust her body and other things.

    My thought is that if Sue was actually like the others, she'd have powers closer to Kitty Pryde and become intangible. While it could be argued that she makes herself invisible, her other abilities suggest there's something more. Discuss amongst yourselves.

  9. #1089
    Incredible Member Oberon's Avatar
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    One of the big problems with defining her power is explaining how she sees. If everything is invisible how does light(s) register in/on her eyes? If she warps light around her this may be a problem too perhaps? I remember this was discussed yeaaaaarrrrss ago. And possibly one of the Old Marvel Official Handbook-y things had some "real" definition.

    I truly don't remember or know? But I guess it would be easier to say all of it is a result of the energy she uses, however she uses it.

  10. #1090
    Astonishing Member Crimz's Avatar
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    I think I remember something about Ultimate Invisible Woman being able to see things made invisible on the spectrum (ultraviolet, Gamma, cosmic rays etc.). Maybe 616 Sue can do the same and that's how she sees? She see's the world differently when she is invisible. An example of it could be here from Waid's run where she made Reed invisible, but can see him.



    If I were writing the FF that would be how I'd explain it from now on. She could see the world differently if she chooses to, which could open up some interesting possibilities.

    I don't have a clue how others can see when she makes them invisible though...
    Last edited by Crimz; 01-13-2018 at 06:30 PM.

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  11. #1091
    Incredible Member Oberon's Avatar
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    An early display of Sue turning Ben or someone invisible resulted in a bit of unease and I think it takes a moment or two for people to adjust. Hasn't been shown lately.

    But I think her ability to turn others/things invisible is pretty neat and has been used creatively in the past.

  12. #1092
    Astonishing Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    An early display of Sue turning Ben or someone invisible resulted in a bit of unease and I think it takes a moment or two for people to adjust. Hasn't been shown lately.

    But I think her ability to turn others/things invisible is pretty neat and has been used creatively in the past.
    Yes, they all feel like they are disappearing, lol!

  13. #1093
    Astonishing Member Crimz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptCleghorn View Post
    Sue's not like the other FF members. the other three have had changes happen to their bodies. Their powers arise because of their changed bodies. Reed is stretchy, Johnny's fire, and Ben's a rock dude. Sue, OTOH, ruens herself and other items invisible. becaise she can turn other things invisible makes me think her power is warping light or using mental abilities to actually make matter invisible. her body hasn't been changed for her powers, it's her mind that can adjust her body and other things.

    My thought is that if Sue was actually like the others, she'd have powers closer to Kitty Pryde and become intangible. While it could be argued that she makes herself invisible, her other abilities suggest there's something more. Discuss amongst yourselves.
    I have no clue. Her powers have always been the most baffling out of the four. Like how does she bend light? Can she do other things with light? So many questions and that's not even getting into her force fields.

    It's great that a character has so many unanswered questions as it means that there are a lot of possible stories left for them. That's pretty great for a character that's been around for over 50 years!
    Last edited by Crimz; 01-14-2018 at 10:43 AM.

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  14. #1094
    FF purist/snob CaptCleghorn's Avatar
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    I think we're dwelling too much on the "how can they see while invisible" thing? Sue's doing something to make it so we can'r see them. There's enough suspension of disbelief there for me. The general problems with being invisible can easily draw us into "but how do they keep from being blonded if they have no eyelids to close to stop blinding light?" or other thoughts like that.

    It's tough to come up with something. The more we try to explain, the more exceptions come up. IMO, the best choice would be to say it's "hyperspace energy" or something that an advanced student in theoretical physics might have an idea about in years, but for comics today, it works.

  15. #1095
    Incredible Member Oberon's Avatar
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    I can agree on that. Sue has always seemed to be able to see her fields and shape, stretch them as needed. She has also been shown to focus 'effects' on more than one field at a time. I think that if Sue easily sees while invisible, sees things she/others(?) make invisible, than she also sees her projections of energy and can shape them or stretch, etc. since the energy responds to how she visualizes the various things she can effect with it.

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