Last edited by Havok83; 03-18-2017 at 08:18 PM.
You forgot to throw in the "It was Apocalypse's influence" excuse...
Time travel is optional.
"Off panel", is a laughable defense.
If it wasn't printed... It didn't happen
Jean made him feel insecure...
But this is the Jean Grey thread, so if you want to further discuss Cyke we should do so on his thread.
Last edited by Havok83; 03-19-2017 at 06:04 AM.
Honestly, Cyclops' actual actions during AvX were not really so obscene as to make him irredeemable, but it was more the way that he was portrayed in the story and the ways that fans reacted to it that really made it difficult to reset the character afterwards. The way he had been portrayed in the years leading up to the event seemed to take a really troubling turn because there was an increasing gap between how the stories clearly wanted us to see him, and how he actually came off. In particular, they seemed to be fixated on pushing this idea that Scott was the ultimate macho alpha male, and making sure to drive home the point that every woman in the vicinity couldn't help but be drawn to his rugged masculinity. Of course, whenever you see a point being made so forcefully, you know that they're compensating for something, and in this case it was clearly this perception that Scott was somehow less of a man because he had been "cucked" by Wolverine, and that it wasn't enough to kill Jean off, or turn Emma into a subservient concubine, or to have Scott slap Logan around every chance he got, they had to make sure every time he was on page that he was the ultimate badass lead dog, not some loser in a gimp suit who can't stop his wife from lusting after another man.
So by the time the event rolled around, there was a clear separation between the fans who took everything the books presented at face value and idolized their hero as much as the X-Men did, and the fans who were sick of this kind of writing and wanted the story to be about something else for a change. Marvel tried to make everyone happy by using the tried and true trick of having Scott turn evil, but to do it in a "cool" way so that his fans would get to see him be a badass but his detractors would be happy to see him taken down. This of course just made everyone even more angry and turned AvX into one of those stories that everyone remembers for the wrong reasons, especially since the actual story is barely noteworthy and was written in a hasty and sloppy fashion by a group of writers who clearly weren't communicating with each other at all. Also, a lot of the posts on this board about the event got really heated and toxic, with some of the talk now seeming like a preview of some of the "alt right" rhetoric you hear coming out of Trump supporters and the like.
Admittedly, I'm biased against Cyclops because I just never liked his personality and his design just makes him look goofy and non-threatening, and while I'm not exactly a huge Wolverine fan either I definitely preferred the chemistry that he had with Jean over anything of her and Scott together. But I feel like this whole debacle reeks of editorial fanboyism, trying so desperately to portray a character a certain way rather than simply allowing the story to evolve naturally that ultimately they could no longer keep it up and had to drop him for a while.
You can't do this with the teen characters, they ar epretty young anf bring some freshness.2) The story arc of Scott and Jean's relationship was finished at the end of their first mini-series in 1994. The next logical step was to have them have more kids. Supposedly, Lobdell intended to do just that by having them have baby Rachel, but Harras nixed it. It ran afoul of aging the characters too much, change vs. illusion of change, etc. Putting them back together now runs into the same problem. The only new place to go with their relationship is the place that, with the exceptions of Reed/Sue and Cage/Jones, Marvel refuses to go. Putting Tyke and Jeen together would just be a rerun. Twice over, if you count Ultimate Scott and Jean.
Can't do this with the adult ones because they are dead now and all the baggage of Scott cheating on Jean.
Last edited by spirit2011; 03-19-2017 at 07:02 AM.
Even Superman. Cyclops is no exception, not by a long shot. However, I don't think anything he did is totally irredeemable. Same goes for Jean Grey. Any character that has been around long enough is bound to do something terrible. Cyclops and Jean Grey have been around for over 50 years. The only way a character is going to be irredeemable is if you're excessively petty and never want your characters to ever change. That's just not going to happen in the real world. I think even those at Marvel understand that.
And I agree that it has been a long time since Cyclops and Jean were together, but it's not like they've been completely absent. Since the Grant Morrison run, there's been X-men Evolution and Wolverine and the X-men, both of which had heavy Cyclops/Jean moments. There were video games like X-men Legends that acknowledged the relationship. It was a major part of Ultimate X-men until 2009. It's become a major plot again in the X-men movies, thanks to X-men: Apocalypse. Long time or not, the relationship is still there. It has also manifested in other books like X-men 92.
Now I'm not saying it's inevitable. Marvel could very well take Cyclops and Jean Grey in a very different direction. However, I think it's just as likely that they could draw them together again. I also think it's possible for Cyclops, Jean Grey, and every character to redeem themselves.
I'm looking forward to seeing X-Men Prime and I wonder does it show the o5 deciding on Jean as the leader.
It all started on Morrison's run and Cyke started to whine about jean (unfairly) and his insecurity, cheat with a hot woman. BUUUUT look jean kissed Wolverine in a weakness moment (months without sex and phisical contact,conversation with Cyke), Cyke is getting "cucked" by Logan drama, that seems to dictate where his character was going into future.
Don't even get me started on the pissing contest with captain america
What Medusa thinks in the middle of the Battlefield where the X-men could be hearing:
"Why didn't they just tell us, Iso ? we would have found a solution. It didn't have to become...This"
What Medusa thinks when the battle is over and she is back and safe in New Atillan:
"Our species' ability to transform through Terrigenesis does not outweigh the lives of even a single mutant"
New interview with Bunn states that it is Jean who convinces the others to join with Magneto and it shows how much they trust her judgement. Also we can expect 2 or 3 new members added.