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  1. #16456
    Mighty Member spirit2011's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Narasinha View Post
    I think that Marvel sees Jeen as Jean. So, for them, they already bring her back.
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  2. #16457
    Ultimate Member Wiccan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    I hate how everyone and their mama can now access the PF when before it used to be just Jean and her kid. Then it was extremely powerful psionics and eventually that wittled down to mutants and now pretty much anyone
    Exactly. How and why did they thought that ruining the Phoenix mythos like that was a good idea? Ugh.

  3. #16458

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    I hate how everyone and their mama can now access the PF when before it used to be just Jean and her kid. Then it was extremely powerful psionics and eventually that wittled down to mutants and now pretty much anyone


    ...

  4. #16459
    Last of my kind ZNOP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Exactly. How and why did they thought that ruining the Phoenix mythos like that was a good idea? Ugh.
    Worse, is that none of pretenders justifiably gained the Phoenix Force in any logical way.
    Last edited by ZNOP; 04-21-2017 at 09:27 AM.
    Time travel is optional.
    "Off panel", is a laughable defense.
    If it wasn't printed... It didn't happen

  5. #16460
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sin Nick View Post


    ...
    Clearly this is an alternate reality, meaning it's basically fan fiction garbage. No mainstream continuity.

  6. #16461
    Astonishing Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Unfortunately thats not too far off from what Marvel has done in recent mainstream continuity which is the problem. Theres nothing to suggest that Wolverine cant beocme Phoenix if he were to access the Force

    I REALLY hope that Jean's series is about her reclaiming her mantle and definitively establishing her as THE Phoenix bc its really become diluted with so many randoms having it. Im kind of conflicted with that as well bc I dont want her to become the Phoenix again but she needs to take her mythos back
    Last edited by Havok83; 04-21-2017 at 09:31 AM.

  7. #16462
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Exactly. How and why did they thought that ruining the Phoenix mythos like that was a good idea? Ugh.
    Because unlike in the Claremont era, when you had a stable writer who was willing to stay on a series long term and develop the characters, these days they get so called named/hot writers who are only going to be on the series for a short time, and are looking for shock value. Like in AvX, Bendis had a Phoenix Cyclops kill Xavier and permanently ruin adult Cyclops to the point he was killed off for good. Adult Cyclops was damaged beyond repair, and the saving grace was the o5 was already here and Cyclops is a teenager in the films.

  8. #16463
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarvelMaster616 View Post
    Wow. Between Thanos and Thor, the Phoenix Force is more prevalent than Jean herself at this point. So much for Wanda and Hope's "No More Phoenix" trick at the end of AvX.

    I'm hoping there's a good reason for this. Perhaps a more active Phoenix Force will help set up the story in Jean's solo series. I hope Marvel does coordinate among writers when using something as powerful as the Phoenix. It would be great if the Phoenix is part of a larger story that'll play out in both Jean's solo series and a larger event down the line. That, or Marvel is just treating the Phoenix like the Cosmic Cube and using it as one big McGuffin. It could really go either way at this point.
    We already know that Jean is meeting many of the major help across Marvel, like Namor, Thor, Ghost Rider, and Dr. Strange. So clearly this is met to set the stage for larger stories down the road. I don't mind the Phoenix attracting people like Thane or being in Thor, in fact I love it. They go get Quentin in Thor to help out with the Phoenix, yet Jean has the premonition where it comes to her.

  9. #16464
    Mighty Member 5cents's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by darewithpeace View Post
    They call adult Jean "the Phoenix" here too. We are slowly honing in on which era of adult Jean, young Jean will meet.
    First X-Lady

  10. #16465

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    Quote Originally Posted by 5cents View Post
    They call adult Jean "the Phoenix" here too. We are slowly honing in on which era of adult Jean, young Jean will meet.
    That makes sense. Teen Jean is just starting the journey to confront this part of her past/future. She's been avoiding it for the most part, going so far as to run from it completely, like we saw in Extraordinary X-men. Now, in her solo series, it seems she's ready to face it head-on. I can think of no better way to gain more insight than to confront her adult self. It's been a long time coming. I really hope it has larger implications for both her solo series and the X-books as a whole.

    I believe that at some point, Marvel is going to create a Messiah Complex-level event around Jean, the Phoenix, and the O5 possibly going back to their timeline. I think the foundation for that story was laid way back in The Trial of Jean Grey. Like we're seeing with Secret Empire, Jean is building up to something big. If she wants to avoid a future where she's dead and doomed, then she has to do something about the Phoenix Force. Hopefully, this is a step in that process.
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  11. #16466
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiccan View Post
    Exactly. How and why did they thought that ruining the Phoenix mythos like that was a good idea? Ugh.
    Wood brought Maddie back in 2014. 616 Red Queen Maddie. Of course Hopeless has to ignore that and bring over his pet demon queen Maddie. Never mind one of the cool things about the Goblin Queen is that she was a beautiful and powerful mutant witch (with some Phoenix power), commanding legions of demons/monsters. This is what happens when you have too many writers.

  12. #16467
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarvelMaster616 View Post
    That makes sense. Teen Jean is just starting the journey to confront this part of her past/future. She's been avoiding it for the most part, going so far as to run from it completely, like we saw in Extraordinary X-men. Now, in her solo series, it seems she's ready to face it head-on. I can think of no better way to gain more insight than to confront her adult self. It's been a long time coming. I really hope it has larger implications for both her solo series and the X-books as a whole.

    I believe that at some point, Marvel is going to create a Messiah Complex-level event around Jean, the Phoenix, and the O5 possibly going back to their timeline. I think the foundation for that story was laid way back in The Trial of Jean Grey. Like we're seeing with Secret Empire, Jean is building up to something big. If she wants to avoid a future where she's dead and doomed, then she has to do something about the Phoenix Force. Hopefully, this is a step in that process.
    If you're right perhaps Jean somehow has something to do with the return of her adult self. Perhaps by Jeen herself ends up accepting the Phoenix as it comes to her, and maybe as that unifies all the Phoenixes around, it paves the way for her adult self to manifest and return. They could go that route.

    But if the o5 do go home, I don't think Marvel wants to sacrifice their popularity. Particularly sense they established at least in the 616 past, there's still an o5 there. That leads the o5, if they go back, to continue their adventures in their home universe and we could see how that affects their own timeline. I believe Marvel is setting things up to where even if they have to send the o5 back, that won't be the end of them.

    The problem would be is that would still leave Cyclops DEAD. Of course this is Marvel and anyone can be brought back. Maybe Emma downloaded his consciousness to her mind and kept it there, while she paid Sinister to create a new clone body for Cyclops.

  13. #16468
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    To add a bit of extra on other characters using the Phoenix, in the 90's Malibu Comics/Ultraverse had a Phoenix Resurrection crossover with the X-Men which also didn't have Jean or Rachel but still had the Phoenix force bestow powers to two Ultra characters, Amber Hunt and Foxfire, and I'd guess that one of them being a newly-introduced redhead was intentional.

    Quote Originally Posted by MarvelMaster616 View Post
    I believe that at some point, Marvel is going to create a Messiah Complex-level event around Jean, the Phoenix, and the O5 possibly going back to their timeline. I think the foundation for that story was laid way back in The Trial of Jean Grey. Like we're seeing with Secret Empire, Jean is building up to something big. If she wants to avoid a future where she's dead and doomed, then she has to do something about the Phoenix Force. Hopefully, this is a step in that process.
    inb4 Avengers and/or Guardians of the Galaxy get shoehorned in, lol.

  14. #16469
    leave Sexyclops to me oldscottsummers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WallStreeter View Post

    But if the o5 do go home, I don't think Marvel wants to sacrifice their popularity. Particularly sense they established at least in the 616 past, there's still an o5 there. That leads the o5, if they go back, to continue their adventures in their home universe and we could see how that affects their own timeline. I believe Marvel is setting things up to where even if they have to send the o5 back, that won't be the end of them.

    The problem would be is that would still leave Cyclops DEAD. Of course this is Marvel and anyone can be brought back. Maybe Emma downloaded his consciousness to her mind and kept it there, while she paid Sinister to create a new clone body for Cyclops.
    Some asked this of Charles Soule already.

    https://twitter.com/CharlesSoule/sta...19586834141185

    So, seems not.

  15. #16470
    Astonishing Member Havok83's Avatar
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    There is no home to go back to. Thats already been dealt with. The only resolution I see at this point is merging the characters with their older counterparts and/or killing them

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