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  1. #10051

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    I'm surprised Venditti stuck around this long. He's been on GL for at least 60+ issues now and that's no joke for today's standards. Gone are the days when creators write the same book for years, unless it's a best-selling title, yet DC seems to really like Venditti for some reason. I don't think I dislike his writing that much, but I agree it definitely feels uneventful most of the time.
    It may just fall under the DC doesn't care about GL banner. They just don't care enough to do anything that would improve it. The title chugs along and holds at its sales numbers. Low, but predicable. Venditti manages to do just enough not to get fired. He's probably a decent guy too. Doesn't take jabs at the company like some others do. Turns his crap in on time. Works with others on these dumbass crossovers. He doesn't give them a reason to fire him. It's just, the product he makes has just been... ok.
    Save Ferris...

  2. #10052
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngryComicBookNerd View Post
    I don't even think he's trying to drag it out because that implies that there's eventually a final destination to reach. I think Venditti is already at his final destination. He wants this status quo and will go out of his way to avoid changing it. That's why Hal is starting to feel stale IMO. Same old same old. Maybe Carol will pop in again around #35 or 36. The cynic in me doubts it'll be anything good though.

    I know there's a lot of Venditti support but I think a change might be good. Don't worry, we're not getting one this year. Maybe 2019. But you look at Green Lanterns. There's opinions both ways on Humphries but the fact is that book was stagnating. I'm not saying Seeley is better, but he is different and it's noticable in his first issues. I'm honestly mildly intrigued. Plus he gave Simon a much needed bump since he's been living in Jess' shadow for most of Hump's run. It's just different, and that's what Hal needs. A different voice. I don't care who. I really don't. Yeah, could be worse and if it is then DC fires that guy and brings someone else in. But to me, at least getting Venditti off the book would be a proactive move on DC's part and shows me that they actually give a crap about it.
    I know he didn't want to write Carol or Hal+Carol to begin with which is why we got that awful breakup as the very first thing he did, I'm not sure if he's changed his mind or if editorial said that he has to patch them up? If it was any other writer I'd assume that that scene in HJGLC #31 was the start of them getting back together but with Venditti I'm not so sure. He's done several scenes with Hal now that are basically going "Here's what Hal (and the reader) is missing out on in life!" but... there have been no steps taken to make any of those things happen. I don't know if those scenes are meant to be the start of a character arc with Hal (something that's been mostly absent from HJGLC), or if they're meant to establish the status quo and say "Hal will not get those things because he's in space all the time (and I don't want to write them)" and that's that. It's painful because I WANT to see more character stuff with Hal but I don't really think Venditti is interested. It's kind of painful to see reviews for the last few issues that have been Hal centric saying that they think he lacks character MOST of the time and Venditti is finally giving him some depth, rather than acknowledging Hal is a complex character that Venditti often doesn't bother giving depth to.

    I was extremely disappointed when Rebirth creative teams were announced and Venditti was still writing Hal. I disliked most of his GL and I had very low expectations for HJGLC. HJGLC has been way, way better than I was expecting but I still don't think it's THAT good and it's still not really the book I want. It frequently comes close to doing things I want only to miss the mark in some key way. The last few issues have been more like things I want to see but if Hal doesn't get something resembling a character arc soon I think that's going to end up pretty unfulfilling. I was ready for a new writer on GL long before Rebirth and while HJGLC has beaten most of my (extremely low) expectations I still want someone new because at this point after 60+ issues I don't think Venditti is ever going to be what I want on GL

  3. #10053
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post

    I would love to see the history between Hal & Guy explored. A lot of what made Guy...well...Guy was his history & animosity with Hal. I'm not sure if the silver age & 80's stuff is still canon, or an updated story was presented under my nose.

    Are Hal & Guy simply a case of two ultra alpha males clashing (like in the excellent GLTAS)? Or did Gardner have a legitimate, or irrational reason for butting heads with Jordan (like the faulty Lantern battery & fiance triangle)?

    If anyone can enlighten me, please do so.

    Damn, I love these ring slingers, and their wacky shared history.
    I don't think Hal and Guy are simply the case of 2 alpha males clashing, or at least, it shouldn't be. Other than Hal, Guy has been there the longest among the Earth lanterns and so their histories really go way back. If I'm not wrong, Guy first appeared when Hal learned that Abin Sur could have either chosen him or Guy but he only got the ring because he was closer (something I'm glad got retconned). Hal then went to meet this Guy person in his civilian identity and they hit it off pretty well.
    GL_059-23.jpg
    In Emerald Dawn II back in the 90s their history was told differently and turned out they first met when Hal got arrested for drunk driving (again, something I wouldn't miss being gone) and Guy was his caseworker. The reason Guy got the ring was because Hal was constantly away from Earth so the Guardians needed a backup. Nobody really liked Guy because he kept picking fights, had anger issues and yeah, was kind of a jerk. They wouldn't think of him as the real Lantern, so he challenged Hal to a fight; the winner got to keep the ring --> he lost.
    Guy-Gardner-Reborn-1-1024x1008.jpg
    There were panels here and there during Hal's tenure where Guy showed up. There was this one time Hal chose a mission somewhere far away in deep space or something to get some me-time and Guy just barged in because he thought Hal would be bored. But there are also a lot of panels in which Hal just ignored Guy or punched him in the face. Unlike modern interpretations, Hal was actually quite stoic and took his work seriously. Guy was the asshole in the League, who picked fight with Bats, constantly got under everyone's skin and made people go "where is Hal?". Guy was the one that was reckless and impulsive, so he got beat up a lot (though in his defense more often than not his bites are actually as loud as his barks). I think like most people, Hal finds Guy annoying and unprofessional, but if speaking as two men I think Hal seemed to like Guy.
    There is certainly some bad blood between them however. Guy is known for having the need to prove himself, and the fact that he was usually in Hal's shadow really didn't help. And then there's the thing with Parallax, so realistically speaking, Hal shouldn't be the first person Guy voted for when it comes to being trustworthy. Oh, and don't forget the mess surrounding Kari Limbo. So overall, my take on their relationship is that they are colleagues who grudgingly respect each other, who would go out for a drink together, doing fist bumps but are not so close they would call each other bros.
    Last edited by Margaret; 11-10-2017 at 10:11 PM.

  4. #10054
    Astonishing Member Johnny's Avatar
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    God I love this image. No idea who the artist is, but I always remember it for some reason and just when I can't find it, suddenly facebook notifies me I had posted it two years ago. lol


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  6. #10056
    Astonishing Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Guess he found himself in the emerald space again.

    Last edited by Johnny; 11-11-2017 at 04:12 PM.

  7. #10057
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    Guess he found himself in the emerald space again.

    http://www.cartoonnetwork.com/video/...d-episode.html

    It's a fun episode the ending is a huge nod to GLTAS, too.

    (the black hair is a little hard to get used to)

  8. #10058
    Astonishing Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Can't see it. US only. Gotta wait till it airs on TV I guess. The black hair doesn't really bother me, what's weird is Hal looking so young on this show. He looks like he's in his mid-20s or something.

  9. #10059
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    Quote Originally Posted by vartox View Post
    I know he didn't want to write Carol or Hal+Carol to begin with which is why we got that awful breakup as the very first thing he did, I'm not sure if he's changed his mind or if editorial said that he has to patch them up? If it was any other writer I'd assume that that scene in HJGLC #31 was the start of them getting back together but with Venditti I'm not so sure. He's done several scenes with Hal now that are basically going "Here's what Hal (and the reader) is missing out on in life!" but... there have been no steps taken to make any of those things happen. I don't know if those scenes are meant to be the start of a character arc with Hal (something that's been mostly absent from HJGLC), or if they're meant to establish the status quo and say "Hal will not get those things because he's in space all the time (and I don't want to write them)" and that's that. It's painful because I WANT to see more character stuff with Hal but I don't really think Venditti is interested. It's kind of painful to see reviews for the last few issues that have been Hal centric saying that they think he lacks character MOST of the time and Venditti is finally giving him some depth, rather than acknowledging Hal is a complex character that Venditti often doesn't bother giving depth to.

    I was extremely disappointed when Rebirth creative teams were announced and Venditti was still writing Hal. I disliked most of his GL and I had very low expectations for HJGLC. HJGLC has been way, way better than I was expecting but I still don't think it's THAT good and it's still not really the book I want. It frequently comes close to doing things I want only to miss the mark in some key way. The last few issues have been more like things I want to see but if Hal doesn't get something resembling a character arc soon I think that's going to end up pretty unfulfilling. I was ready for a new writer on GL long before Rebirth and while HJGLC has beaten most of my (extremely low) expectations I still want someone new because at this point after 60+ issues I don't think Venditti is ever going to be what I want on GL
    This is a great post.

    When I think about it....is the problem the writer....or the editor?

    If a writer is oblivious to the great points you are making, I would think an editor would connect the dots.

  10. #10060
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    Quote Originally Posted by Margaret View Post
    I don't think Hal and Guy are simply the case of 2 alpha males clashing, or at least, it shouldn't be. Other than Hal, Guy has been there the longest among the Earth lanterns and so their histories really go way back. If I'm not wrong, Guy first appeared when Hal learned that Abin Sur could have either chosen him or Guy but he only got the ring because he was closer (something I'm glad got retconned). Hal then went to meet this Guy person in his civilian identity and they hit it off pretty well.
    GL_059-23.jpg
    In Emerald Dawn II back in the 90s their history was told differently and turned out they first met when Hal got arrested for drunk driving (again, something I wouldn't miss being gone) and Guy was his caseworker. The reason Guy got the ring was because Hal was constantly away from Earth so the Guardians needed a backup. Nobody really liked Guy because he kept picking fights, had anger issues and yeah, was kind of a jerk. They wouldn't think of him as the real Lantern, so he challenged Hal to a fight; the winner got to keep the ring --> he lost.
    Guy-Gardner-Reborn-1-1024x1008.jpg
    There were panels here and there during Hal's tenure where Guy showed up. There was this one time Hal chose a mission somewhere far away in deep space or something to get some me-time and Guy just barged in because he thought Hal would be bored. But there are also a lot of panels in which Hal just ignored Guy or punched him in the face. Unlike modern interpretations, Hal was actually quite stoic and took his work seriously. Guy was the asshole in the League, who picked fight with Bats, constantly got under everyone's skin and made people go "where is Hal?". Guy was the one that was reckless and impulsive, so he got beat up a lot (though in his defense more often than not his bites are actually as loud as his barks). I think like most people, Hal finds Guy annoying and unprofessional, but if speaking as two men I think Hal seemed to like Guy.
    There is certainly some bad blood between them however. Guy is known for having the need to prove himself, and the fact that he was usually in Hal's shadow really didn't help. And then there's the thing with Parallax, so realistically speaking, Hal shouldn't be the first person Guy voted for when it comes to being trustworthy. Oh, and don't forget the mess surrounding Kari Limbo. So overall, my take on their relationship is that they are colleagues who grudgingly respect each other, who would go out for a drink together, doing fist bumps but are not so close they would call each other bros.
    The continuity is a mess.

    IIRC, Guy was normal (with anger issues he seemed able to control) until Hal unknowingly have him a faulty GL battery that exploded, and sent Gardner into the phantom zone. While presumed dead, Hal fell in love with Guy's fiance. Guy watched all that from the zone while his head injuries went unhealed. Hal & Kal-El saved Guy, but the had brain damage which explained his erratic behavior. Guy blamed Hal for the battery mishap, plus getting busy with his fiance.

    Following his iconic one punch from Batman, another blow to the head returned Guy to his previous personality.

    Speaking of which....it would have been fun if Guy ran into Mon-El in the phantom zone.

    Given what we know of concussions from NFL players, and pro-wrestlers, I really think Guy's head trauma should be revisited (provided the 1980's stuff is still canon). Or, show that the Guardians were really heartless for not treating him when he became a GL full time.

    Hal using the rope-a-dope to tire out Guy was genius! Geoff retconned it, but apparently Guy used his ring to stay in his physical prime while Hal aged naturally.

    If Kyle is a cosmic Peter Parker, one could argue Guy is a weird cosmic amalgamation of Normal & Harry Osborn, lol!

    But yeah, I miss smart Hal. I absolutely despise how writers seemed to blend Hal & Guy personalities when they were always meant to polar opposites.

    I can see Hal & Guy being somewhat similar before they got rings (brave men with big hearts), but the paths their lives took after getting rings should always put them on opposite sides of the spectrum.

    Hal's experiences should have only made him better, or more world-weary while Guy's experiences should always leave one pondering if he's truly lost it, or not.

  11. #10061
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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny View Post
    God I love this image. No idea who the artist is, but I always remember it for some reason and just when I can't find it, suddenly facebook notifies me I had posted it two years ago. lol

    She got that look: Bro, you ain't gotta do that, just ask for my number.

    At the same time, with the current climate in Hollywood, as his unofficial PR person, Hal doing that was purely an accident. I can see Guy doing that on purpose.

    Also....I hope Hal keeps his eye on the road.....

    Reminds me of those jerks that text & drive....

  12. #10062
    Astonishing Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anthony Shaw View Post
    Hal should gone the John Cusack route, and used his ring to create a boom box playing Peter Gabriel's "In your eyes".
    Everybody loves that iconic scene, but does nobody remember that in the movie that move totally failed? She doesn't even get out of bed....

  13. #10063
    Astonishing Member j9ac9k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Margaret View Post
    I don't think Hal and Guy are simply the case of 2 alpha males clashing, or at least, it shouldn't be.... Nobody really liked Guy because he kept picking fights, had anger issues and yeah, was kind of a jerk.
    Guy was given a ring despite his brain damage by renegade Guardians after they split based on how to address the original Crisis. And then he also tried to murder Hal and John, so he was more than just a "jerk" when he was introduced. They toned him down to simply being a jerk after his time on Malthus and he became a regular in the GLC title.

    I never liked the Guy/Hal dynamic back then because Guy was always a jerk trying to get under Hal's skin and Hal was always the "elder statesman" who was serious and professional by contrast but also letting Guy get under his skin. I'm glad they've moved on from that.

  14. #10064
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    This is pretty interesting:



    WB commissioned developers Double-Helix to develop a Justice League game to tie-in to the planned Justice League: Mortal movie by George Miller.

    Hal was the Green Lantern in it and the first level would've seen you play as him as he fights through Warworld and takes on Mongul.

    Sinestro was also in the game, and there was concept art for Star Sapphire but it appears she was never properly added to the game.

    The story for the game was developed by the late, great, Dwayne McDuffie and Marv Wolfman.

    When Justice League: Mortal fell through WB then had the developers shift gears to developing a tie-in game to the Green Lantern movie, which became Green Lantern: Rise of the Manhunters.

  15. #10065
    Astonishing Member Johnny's Avatar
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    Bad girl Carol.


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