1. #18766
    Astonishing Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    How important do y'all feel Nightwing's leadership is to the Titans? I was actually kinda looking forward to what I assumed would be a book led by Wally and what his return to the known universe would mean, maybe even having him lead the team. I don't think Nightwing has to be the leader, but now that we've had such a mediocre run, I want him to have a proper shot at it.

  2. #18767
    ♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦♦ Godlike13's Avatar
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    The leader position has been meaningless with current Titans.

  3. #18768
    Astonishing Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    The leader position has been meaningless with current Titans.
    Definitely, but I'd still like Dick (or Wally) to lead a team in a good book.

  4. #18769
    THE RED HOOD JasonTodd428's Avatar
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    I've pretty much given up on a good Titans book or even an interesting Nightwing book at this point. I think they made a huge mistake in not spinning a completely new direction and/or team for Dick out of Grayson once it ended. Instead what we've got is the same boring thing Dick seems to always end up being saddled with after they do something interesting with him that pushes the character. It's pretty sad when the best Dick Grayson showings lately have been in out of continuity books.

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  5. #18770
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hizashi View Post
    How important do y'all feel Nightwing's leadership is to the Titans? I was actually kinda looking forward to what I assumed would be a book led by Wally and what his return to the known universe would mean, maybe even having him lead the team. I don't think Nightwing has to be the leader, but now that we've had such a mediocre run, I want him to have a proper shot at it.
    I don't see much evidence that Dick even leads the abysmal current bunch of Titans--or that he's even much of a member of it at all. He looks strictly there to sell books and hold up the scenery. This roster sucked in the 60's and it's sucking even worse now. I think Dick should leave that title and get a new group of Outsiders. The problem with the last attempt at a Nightwing+ Outsiders book was that the writer was allowed to put the entire focus everywhere EXCEPT on Nightwing--the star, the reason anybody buys the rag. I feel that Dick's current treatment is shameful.

  6. #18771
    Astonishing Member Hizashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oasis1313 View Post
    I don't see much evidence that Dick even leads the abysmal current bunch of Titans--or that he's even much of a member of it at all. He looks strictly there to sell books and hold up the scenery. This roster sucked in the 60's and it's sucking even worse now. I think Dick should leave that title and get a new group of Outsiders. The problem with the last attempt at a Nightwing+ Outsiders book was that the writer was allowed to put the entire focus everywhere EXCEPT on Nightwing--the star, the reason anybody buys the rag. I feel that Dick's current treatment is shameful.
    No argument here, I do recall Nightwing being called the leader, but it is meaningless in the current Titans book. First big disappointment from Rebirth, which I've enjoyed overall. If my profile pic didn't give it away, Cyclops is among my favorite characters, but I find myself more of a DC guy lately, I'm hoping 2018 treats Nightwing and the Titans better.
    Last edited by Hizashi; 01-04-2018 at 08:31 PM.

  7. #18772
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    Quote Originally Posted by oasis1313 View Post
    I don't see much evidence that Dick even leads the abysmal current bunch of Titans--or that he's even much of a member of it at all. He looks strictly there to sell books and hold up the scenery. This roster sucked in the 60's and it's sucking even worse now. I think Dick should leave that title and get a new group of Outsiders. The problem with the last attempt at a Nightwing+ Outsiders book was that the writer was allowed to put the entire focus everywhere EXCEPT on Nightwing--the star, the reason anybody buys the rag. I feel that Dick's current treatment is shameful.
    I still think that something like Outsiders doesn't really suit Dick, he fits better in classical superhero teams, and there are Batfamily members that fit better in more anti heroic book.

    I think the big problems with Titans is really that nothing really big has happened in their book in a long time, at best they fight one of their biggest villains from their old stories. I mean when was even the last time they went to space or something like that ?

    And I don't think that the Titans need to become something like the Outsiders, they need bigger stories and better writing and to be treated like an adult team.

  8. #18773
    Extraordinary Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hizashi View Post
    How important do y'all feel Nightwing's leadership is to the Titans?
    I think Dick leading the Titans through his history is important to his character, as it defines some of his best qualities.

    I think the Titans themselves don't matter and haven't mattered in twenty years.

    I think Dick leading the Titans now is holding his character back and preventing him from growing.
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  9. #18774
    Spectacular Member wvchemteach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aahz View Post
    I still think that something like Outsiders doesn't really suit Dick, he fits better in classical superhero teams, and there are Batfamily members that fit better in more anti heroic book.

    I think the big problems with Titans is really that nothing really big has happened in their book in a long time, at best they fight one of their biggest villains from their old stories. I mean when was even the last time they went to space or something like that ?

    And I don't think that the Titans need to become something like the Outsiders, they need bigger stories and better writing and to be treated like an adult team.
    I think you are onto something here. So far every attempt to bring the original Titans back together seems to be some attempt to 1) bring back a time of gentler times of a family style comic from the 60s or 2) recapture the lightning that was the New Teen Titans of the 80s.

    I think for a Titans book to be successful they need to go a direction they've never gone before. I think the key is more of a covert op style team. Perhaps ultimately under the direction of Batman, but with Nightwing as the field leader.

    Then you need to find a reason to justify each and every member in the idea that they are a behind the scenes type team.

    Nightwing brings stealth, leadership, and problem solving. Arsenal brings stealth, improvisation of weaponry and problem solving to the team. Tempest brings both raw strength and mystical powers to the team. Donna bring raw power. Wally brings speed, which in a way can be stealthy. Omen brings mental abilities as well as teleportation.

    The next question is: are there any other characters that aren't being utilized or not being utilized correctly? As it stands Raven and Starfire don't really fit with the Teen Titans and truthfully Cyborg doesn't fit with the Justice League.

    Not sure any of the 3 would fit with a covert op team, but there are others. Rose Wilson could be a possibility... other unpowered heroes such as Orphan, Huntress, the new Red Arrow, and Katana are also possibilities.

    The person I'd love writing this sort of book would be someone like Tom King.
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  10. #18775
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    Quote Originally Posted by wvchemteach View Post
    I think for a Titans book to be successful they need to go a direction they've never gone before. I think the key is more of a covert op style team. Perhaps ultimately under the direction of Batman, but with Nightwing as the field leader.

    Then you need to find a reason to justify each and every member in the idea that they are a behind the scenes type team.

    Nightwing brings stealth, leadership, and problem solving. Arsenal brings stealth, improvisation of weaponry and problem solving to the team. Tempest brings both raw strength and mystical powers to the team. Donna bring raw power. Wally brings speed, which in a way can be stealthy. Omen brings mental abilities as well as teleportation.
    The problem with titans as special ops are not their powers but the personalities, Dick, Wally and the other have never really been characters that like to work from the shadows, then going black ops might interesting for some imo but it is imo not a fitting direction for the Titans on the long run imo.

  11. #18776
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    Nightwing #36 was quite dark. The Judge is appearing to be a great villain.

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  14. #18779
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    Just started reading Batman: Murderer?. Nightwing is pretty awesome in it. Great fight scenes as well.

  15. #18780
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    The spec-ops idea by Joe Casey ruined WildCATS forever. Dick and Roy could go there, but the others aren't really suited for cloak and dagger. That's why I'd like an Outsiders--or maybe a differently-titled group--of existing characters so that the writer isn't so enamored of his new babies that he neglects Nightwing--the STAR. I would bring in characters like Frankenstein, Element Woman, Caitlyn Fairchild, Klarion, Elasti-Girl (yeah, I'd resurrect Rita Farr), a Gorilla, maybe Orca--the most off-beat, and for the MOST part butt-ugly characters I could find. I'd love to have Grifter, but one male good-looking character would probably be enough; besides, Dick would have issues with him shooting everyone in sight. You could put someone like Tao on the team, and let Dick try to figure out how to stay ahead of him--show how smart Dick is by letting him constantly outwit Tao and actually use that character for good. Even the PRESENT Titans team could work--if DC tried taking them in different directions instead of regurgitating old stuff like Hatton Corners, Honey Bun, etc etc etc with so-called "new twists". Nobody here but me remembers that lousy 60's stuff and it has NOT aged well.

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