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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mastermind View Post
    I don't think Aquaman will be in the Justice League movie, though. I think the line up will be the New 52 version minus him.
    Inclined to agree. Or they might do what they did in Justice League War and introduce Shazam, if some of those rumours about the Rock pay off.

  2. #77
    Nostalgia Fanwanker Pharozonk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneNecromancer View Post
    Inclined to agree. Or they might do what they did in Justice League War and introduce Shazam, if some of those rumours about the Rock pay off.
    I would rather see Aquaman. How awesome would it be to see him riding on a school of sharks?
    "In any time, there will always be a need for heroes." - the Time Trapper, Legion of Superheroes #61(1994)

    "What can I say? I guess I outgrew maturity.." - Bob Chipman

  3. #78
    Spadassin Extraordinaire Auguste Dupin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slade Wilson View Post
    Civil War and Secret Invasion are very popular (Civil War is actually one of my most favorite Marvel stories ever plus I am a huge Mark Millar fan, this is the creator of Kick-Ass for gods sake :P ) and personally I LOVED Blackest Night - possibly my most favorite DC event yet besides Our Worlds at War.

    I am surprised you didnt list Fear Itself though since that is one event that is almost universally loathed from what I have read. people also seem to love to bash AvX and to much lesser degree Age of Ultron and I loved both of them immensely.

    I dont get this trend to hate on events and particularly their writers (this negativity towards writers like Johns, Bendis etc. is getting on my nerves because they are great writers IMO). maybe its because Marvel and DC are doing events so regularly and it becomes the popular thing to just hate on them by default, I dont know. I judge a story by how I like it and how it affects me, wether its an event, crossover, ongoing arc or one shot. If a particular event doesnt appeal to me I skip it (like I did with Infinity - just wasnt my type of story) or if I am not sure I read one or two issues and if its not to my liking then I drop it and move on to better comics (Its not like there arent enough to choose from) instead of endlessly jumping on the hate wagon against a writer, creator or event. Always sickens me how much hatred and anger people have in themselves over such things.

    Also ultimately different people like different things. I am sure you can find even people who loved Fear Itself. Doesnt make them inferior fans that shouldnt be taken seriously.

    As for what you said about writing - and again this all depends on ones personal point of view - but to me Infinite Crisis was pretty complex, but maybe thats because I usually dont read much of the cosmic stuff and someone who reads a lot of that might simply experience it differently. But while IC was complex (to me) it wasnt confusing like FC and was enormously entertaining and fun.

    And I thought particularly Civil War and Blackest Night were greatly written but again this is just my personal point of view and maybe I just experience comics differently then you do and things dont appeal to me, do greatly appeal to you and vice versa. I love so many comic stories that other people online seem to hate and ridicule all the time. Their problem, not mine.
    Well, I don't remember how it was received at the time, but I can tell you that, recently on the pre reboot CBR forum, there was actually a few discussions on Civil War and the overwhelming majority of the comments were in the line of "that embarassing story where every one was acting out of character for the sake of having the heroes come to blows and put their friends into the Negative Zone". I was actually quite surprised. And overall, it seems like it's not very well liked on the internet. And I clearly remember people being like "Are they still in Savage Land, for Uathu's sake?" for Secret Invasion, and complaining about it being the least secret invasion ever. In the end, I'd say both had interesting premisses, but ultimately failed due to their very status as events, preventing them from dealing with their subject in the subtle manner required. Big crazy action only works to an extend when you have to deal with the consequences of a law turning superheroes into governement agents, or when portraying an invasion that's supposed to be a f.cking secret.
    As far as Blackest Night went.....meh. Dead heroes coming back to life so they can act like trolls to living heroes wasn't that interesting a premisse to begin with.
    And please....I was hating on events and Geoff Johns before it became cool to do so.
    Hold those chains, Clark Kent
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  4. #79
    Lv 67 Pinsir's Avatar
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    Marvel can't do Civil War. None of their heroes have secret identities.
    Also visit my blog where I expose Wonder Woman for the criminal she is!

    How come these anonymous sources failed to report Zack Snyder had left post-production on Justice League? They seem to know everything now...

  5. #80
    Astonishing Member Jeevanjacobjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slade Wilson View Post
    Thats why I disagree with user Clark Kent actually. That whole "Phases" model is already being done by Marvel, WB shouldnt copy it. For the same reason Justice League: Origins shouldnt be adapted. Dont get me wrong I love both Geoff Johns and Jim Lee (my most fav artist of all time) and I actually really loved Origins as an Origin story for the JL but that story is basically (and oddly) almost an exact copy of The Avengers movie (except for a few details) so doing a JL movie like this would be way to similar to Avengers and come across as a copy of Marvels work. Not a good idea. WB needs to go in the exact opposite direction and come up with an original story that has its own feel, structure and identity seperate from Avengers. So forget the "Phases" model and forget adapting Origins to the big screen - WB needs to create something of its own not a darker mirage of Disneys Marvelverse.

    Thats why I loved Man of Steel despite its undeniable flaws. At least it was something very different from Marvels stuff with a mythology and feel of its own that can really serve as the foundation of a DCCU that stands entirely on its own and cant be accused of duplicating Marvel all the time. These are two very different universes in the comics with a very different tone and characters (and thats the fun of reading both Marvel and DC for me - because they feel so different) - thats why the movie versions should be to.

    While I would love for the movies to connect with the Arrowverse, it would limit both too much and it would require retroactively cramming things together to make things fit, which would not be a good idea. It would only work if Arrow had been conceived from the start as part of the movies (which is why Agents of SHIELD works as part of the MCU), which obviously is not the case.

    So as awesome as it would be to see Amell and Gustin stand side by side with Cavill, Affleck, Gadot and Fisher - not gonna happen.

    Personally I would love it if WB would release a new movie every 2 years or so and make smaller movies about lesser known or "greyer" characters in between (yeah I admit I want that Deathstroke movie).

    But as for the bigger movies a good plan would be this:

    Man of Steel
    Man of Steel 2 (introducing Batman, Wonder Woman, Cyborg and possibly others)
    Justice League
    Batman
    Flash
    Wonder Woman
    Justice League 2
    Man of Steel 3
    Batman 2
    Flash 2
    Wonder Woman 2
    Justice League 3

    etc.

    Those movies can then also be used to bring in some other DC heroes to test wether or not audiences respond well to them and if they do they can be then given solo movies as well.
    I do agree with your point about DC doing something different...but they can still do it with the phases idea (not that I want them to do it...but, I would be interested in what they come up with).

    What they are doing right now is different...not doing solo movies and not leading directly into the 'main' movie (both of which have been done by other studios), but using two movies to establish the trio (most popular/widely recognized superhero characters - Superman, Batman and WW).

    I loved Man of Steel and all the themes it explored (That's why I like DC movies; they tend to make us think...Marvel movies? Not so much. But, they are fun to watch).

    Agreed with your point about Arrowverse...Just because Marvel is doing it, doesn't mean DC should. I like that they are encouraging different takes on each characters. TV Shows allows these characters to be introduced to the audience (a smaller audience, of course). But, if the shows are good, those folks are bound to show up for the movies (assuming they promote it well)...and if the movie is good, they will recommend it to their friends..leading to more business.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    I say go for White Martians and Starro. Starro could be wicked cool on screen. Think about it. THE AVENGERS fought off an alien invasion in Manhattan. That's cool and all, but for Superman to even need to call upon his fellow heroes, it needs to be a threat to all creation. Now think of Starro as some weird alien god that the White Martians worship. Say the JUSTICE LEAGUE is fighting for the very soul of Earth. Have them fighting creatures beyond imagination. Make it nuts.
    Starro would be awesome..but, would it be too comicbooky? (As far as the general audience are concerned, it's a giant octopus). Not sure how they can make it work with their realistic universe.

    White Martians...that is even more awesome. A great way to introduce Martian Manhunter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post

    I'd like to see a few NEW GODS films, before Darkseid is even in a JUSTICE LEAGUE flick. Do FINAL CRISIS as a film. Have Darkseid just conquer everything. Make him such a threat that Superman himself can barely stay in the same room as him. He is absolute order, and Superman is chaos. Superman comes from chaos. He is the ultimate equalizer. The Champion of those that are oppressed. Make Orion a JUSTICE LEAGUE member. He can be DC's SILVER SURFER. I don't want a weak little franchise only centering around the JL, I want a rich tapestry for the characters to interact with. If MARVEL is the world outside your window, than DC should be pure mythology. Alien sun gods, and immortal warrior princesses.
    Agreed.

    Also give him some character (In origins, it felt like Darkseid is just another baddie).

    Well, they are going with the realistic universe, so I am not sure whether we will see all that...but, I would love for DC to do that!
    DC Extended Universe Thread (DCEU)

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  6. #81
    Astonishing Member Jeevanjacobjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clark_Kent View Post
    oh, absolutely. For the regular audience, it's way too much. My plan basically requires that you see every film, and you can't miss any. It'd never work.

    But for me, personally, I'd just love to see it. If nothing else, it'd make a pretty wicked graphic novel series
    That I agree
    DC Extended Universe Thread (DCEU)

    That's how it starts. The fever. The rage. The feeling of powerlessness. That turns good men....Cruel - Alfred.

    This may be the only thing that I do that matters - Bruce.

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  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auguste Dupin View Post
    Well, I don't remember how it was received at the time, but I can tell you that, recently on the pre reboot CBR forum, there was actually a few discussions on Civil War and the overwhelming majority of the comments were in the line of "that embarassing story where every one was acting out of character for the sake of having the heroes come to blows and put their friends into the Negative Zone". I was actually quite surprised. And overall, it seems like it's not very well liked on the internet. And I clearly remember people being like "Are they still in Savage Land, for Uathu's sake?" for Secret Invasion, and complaining about it being the least secret invasion ever. In the end, I'd say both had interesting premisses, but ultimately failed due to their very status as events, preventing them from dealing with their subject in the subtle manner required. Big crazy action only works to an extend when you have to deal with the consequences of a law turning superheroes into governement agents, or when portraying an invasion that's supposed to be a f.cking secret.
    As far as Blackest Night went.....meh. Dead heroes coming back to life so they can act like trolls to living heroes wasn't that interesting a premisse to begin with.
    And please....I was hating on events and Geoff Johns before it became cool to do so.
    well I guess we wont see eye to eye on many things. While I am not the biggest fan of Secret Invasion, I thought Civil War was very cool and it has high ratings on comic book shop-websites and was critically well received as well. When Fear Itself came out I read a lot of comments online like "It doesnt have the quality of Marvels best events like Civil war etc."

    But again as I said, this is all a matter of personal point of view and preference. I dont have a problem if the majority on CBR hates Civil War, it wont change my perception of it. Also the (albeit very vocal) online communites dont make up 100 % of the readership and the people who buy comics. There are probabably millions of people who regularly buy comics, who never come on forums like this. So even if the majority on CBR has a negative opinion on something, that doesnt mean all that much really because they make only a small percentage of the entire readership and someone elses opinion certainly will not make me suddenly dislike a comic I previously loved.

    Well and about Blackest Night - thats where we see things so vastly different. I LOVE that premise that dead heroes (and villains) that we havent seen for a long time, who are missed by the characters or whom they have certain history with come back to life and torment the living characters. If I would imagine my own father becoming reanimated as a horrible creature that torments me - it would rip my heart out. And thats exactly the kind of emotionally powerful storytelling that I love in comics. When it goes for the pain and the heart. Blackest Night had so many great moments that affected me emotionally. What you mock as "meh" and "trolling the heroes" to me is exactly the kind of emotional comic book story that I love. And thats why we can debate this for the next 10 years and it wont change anything. I love this kind of story, you dont. Lets move on, please. I really dont want to have the whole "hater vs defender" debate about stuff that I love. Different people like different things, lets leave it at that.


    @Jeevanjacobjohn

    Finally someone who also loved Man of Steel. I feel like all I am ever doing on the internet is to defend that movie to haters and having to justify why I love it.

  8. #83
    Astonishing Member Jeevanjacobjohn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    Heck, they could adapt Throne of Atlantis. Not only is it a good story and very "cinematic" already, but it'd be a cool way to introduce Aquman into the film-verse.
    Quote Originally Posted by Auguste Dupin View Post
    I kinda have a hard time seeing Man Of Steel Superman struggling against Atlanteans.
    but at least that would avoid the alien invasion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    I don't think an army of Aquamen would be a good idea for the first big JUSTICE LEAGUE film.

    It's just too hookey, and not a big enough threat for the guy who took the World Engine to his chest and barely broke a sweat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    Depends on how they do it. A highly trained army of super-strong battle-hardened warriors with highly advanced technology could be a serious threat. Especially if they do the "drown the coast" part of the Atlantean's battle plan. Plus, Ocean Master took out Superman, Wonder Woman, and Aquaman all at once with his trident, so you can make him a serious threat pretty easily.
    Agree with Punisher...it really depends upon the execution. Since 70% of Earth is covered in water (and don't forget all the aquatic life...a large percentage of Earth's species, many of which we haven't even discovered.

    MOS Superman is strong and all, but he isn't strong/fast enough to stop all the water drowning cities, save all the people (okay, maybe most), battle all the Atlanteans..oh, don't forget Aquaman.

    Sure, he could get a lot of help from the world militaries...but, don't forget that the Atlanteans are technologically advanced and far more superior.

    They could do it.....it would be very expensive though (Yes, WB has the money, but I doubt that an older studio like WB would take those chances. Marvel is a younger studio...they took some chances, and have been rewarded heavily for it).
    DC Extended Universe Thread (DCEU)

    That's how it starts. The fever. The rage. The feeling of powerlessness. That turns good men....Cruel - Alfred.

    This may be the only thing that I do that matters - Bruce.

    Stay down, if I wanted it, you would be dead already - Clark.

  9. #84
    Mighty Member Clark_Kent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slade Wilson View Post
    No offense taken

    I can only speak for myself but Final Crisis made me constantly shake my head and go "What the hell is going on?" It had way, way, way too many characters and the plot seemed to be all over the place. To be honest I had a lot of problems keeping up with the plot and reading it was more like a chore to me and not at all fun. In fact the whole thing would become so confusing to me that I would regularly tune out while reading and just skip entire things because I didnt understand what they meant or how they were connected to each other. Lots of stuff seemed to be totally random as well where I would ask myself "Where does that suddenly come from, this makes no sense".

    All in all reading FC was exhausting to me and thats not what comics should be like. But this is really just me and I understand if others dont feel that way but I can only speak for myself. And general audiences would be even more confused by this. I mean give Final Crisis to a fan of superherofilms who has never read the comics before. He would throw it away after 5 pages or so.
    Thank you! A very well-written response, and you explained why you didn't like it without resorting to the usual anti-Morrison rhetoric.

    While I both agree & disagree (I found parts of it confusing on my first couple reads, but eventually it clicked and is now my favorite DC story of all-time), I couldn't "like" your post more. Thank you!

    And for the record, when I suggested adapting it, I meant an adaptation that focuses on the JL characters & excluding the rest...Darkseid & his minions take over, Superman in the future, Batman captured, etc. But definitely no Montoya, no "Supermen of the Multiverse", no Monitors, no Manndrak, and none of the extraneous stuff. Much, much simpler than the book.

  10. #85
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Starro could totally work as some screwed up Lovecraft type cosmic god.

    Perhaps he enslaved the White Martians a few hundred years ago, and now wants Earth.

    The Justice League needs threats that encompass all time and space, not just the fate of a city.
    Follow your inner moonlight, do not hide the madness. -Ginsberg

  11. #86
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Mastermind View Post
    Ocean Master is however strong as the writer wants him to be. And Johns overpowered Superman to a massive degree in that first JL arc.

    I don't think Aquaman will be in the Justice League movie, though. I think the line up will be the New 52 version minus him.
    We're talking about Ocean Master here. Until Johns came along, he wasn't really anybody.

    Superman has bench pressed the entire weight of the planet Earth for multiple days, and defeated an imp with the power of the Demiruge, all in the NEW 52.
    Follow your inner moonlight, do not hide the madness. -Ginsberg

  12. #87

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    Does anyone know whatever happened to the 4 low budget movies DC announced? (Suicide Squad, Booster Gold, Deathstroke, and Team 7) I haven't heard anything about those movie's since they were announced. Have they been cancelled or something?

  13. #88
    Ultimate Member Robotman's Avatar
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    it's my fanboy dream to see Darkseid on the big screen. as much as i loved the Avengers it kind of broke my heart to see Thanos at the end. i knew it may crush any chance of seeing Darkseid in a movie.
    but now there is definitely hope. if they can use MoS 2 to foreshadow an invasion from Apokolips it would be amazing to see the Justice League face him in their first outing.
    maybe have Darkseid use Lex as his liaison to earth instead of Ugly Manheim. Lex has made deals with Brainiac in the past, they can just change roles. Lex for Manheim and Darkseid for Brainiac.

    studios have to take into consideration the similarities between villains and characters. It does seem Marvel and WB/DC are in a race to get their version of similar characters to the live action universe. I don't think it was a coinsidence that DC decide to make a Flash tv show soon after Marvel decided to have Quicksilver in The Avengers sequel. And have you seen Marvel's newest version of Deathlok? He's pretty much Cyborg (yes I know Deathlok was created first). They made him look similar to the Agents of Shield version. Interesting that they'd change his look to resemble a character DC has given a huge push.



    So you know it would be huge for WB/DC to have Darkseid face the Justice League before Thanos faces the Avengers. There's no doubt they realize this too.
    Last edited by Robotman; 05-04-2014 at 09:39 PM.

  14. #89
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    Personally I am getting really sick of the constant comparisons between Marvel and DC. Its always "DC has to do this and that because Marvel did it or before Marvel can do it" . And its because of constant thinking like that among the audience that DC is always looking at what Marvel does and playing catch up instead of simply focusing on doing their own thing. Thats why Marvel has had a clear plan and vision for years while DC has always been unfocused and all over the place. In my opinion not only DC/WB but most of all the fans really need to STOP turning this into an endless battle/race between Marvel and DC and start accepting and respecting that these are two different universes that need their own identities and need to do their own thing without looking every 2 seconds over their shoulders at what the other company is doing. So, so, so sick of this endless Marvel vs DC debate.

    It shouldnt matter who does what first or who is adapting which character. All that should matter is the story and the characters and making the best possible movies. Who gives a damn wether Quicksilver or Flash, Ms Marvel or Wonder Woman, Thanos or Darkseid come first? This is starting to feel like an election year where all that matters for politicians is who ends up in office instead of focusing on whats best for everybody.
    Last edited by Slade Wilson; 05-05-2014 at 12:40 AM.

  15. #90
    Ultimate Member Robotman's Avatar
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    Welcome to the world of comics and pop culture.

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