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  1. #2011
    Fantastic Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Just found time to sit down to read Iron Fist #5 and I got to say this issue was Epic! Danny was such an O.G. in this issue that I could barley contain myself while reading it. One thing that I really loved about this issue was that seemed like a love song to die hard Danny Rand fans. Almost as if the writer ,Ed Brisson, made it his mission to lock down and forever lock in that Danny Rand deserves his mantel. With all the recent "Twitter Press" dealing with the netflix show and previous writers leaving doubt of Danny's worth Brisson all but said "Quiet that noise Danny Rand is Iron Fist, so deal with it!".

    I could kiss that man right now, Im so happy!

  2. #2012
    Fantastic Member DragonsChi's Avatar
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    Now that I read the issue I took the time to read the reviews and I must say Long and Atlantis you have excellent insight on the issue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pav View Post
    Won't say much that hasn't already been said. I enjoyed the latest issue and the end to our first arc.

    I do feel it was the quickest read of the bunch so far, and I also wasn't wild about how fast the fight turned for Danny after he had his realization. Sure, it's kind of fun seeing Danny and his powers "One Punch Man"ing people, but I'd have rather seen Divine Wolf put up more of a fight even with Danny fully powered and harnessing his chi and all that.

    Nevertheless, this issue and the arc in general were quite excellent. I've mentioned in previous posts how much I like Brisson's characterization of Danny, but I also want to point out how adept Brisson has been at utilizing continuity to give his stories that extra heft and meaning to the overall mythos of the Iron Fist. The island of Liu Shi and its inhabitants are welcome additions, and I like how their inclusion helps to explain what happened when K'un Lun became corrupted politically. The reveal of Divine Wolf as the original One was a cool add, and I hope we see him again. Tien, your description of Divine Wolf's complexities hit the nail on the head, and I can see him in a Prince of Orphans -type role in the future: an antagonistic ally, and someone who knows way more about everything than Danny does! (I wonder what Divine Wolf and Prince of Orphans would think of each other.)

    Also worth mentioning, as others have noted, is how great Brisson's understanding of Danny's role as champion of K'un Lun, how he feels about that role, and the metacommentary about that role. I liked Danny's realization that he has been weakening because his relationship with K'un Lun has weakened, and seeing him fight back against his accusers was great. Certainly, Danny's backstory has been made more complicated/complex with the revelations over the years regarding the corrupt Yu-Ti, but I love seeing Danny trying to rise above the circumstances of his life and live with grace and nobility.

    Based on the solicits of future issues, as well as the final page of the last issue, it sounds like Danny is going to try to find a way back to K'un Lun in order to help rebuild it. I hope we continue to see Danny "finding himself" on his travels; seeing Danny fleshed out, three-dimensional, and realistic is a joy: the work Brisson is doing with the character is going to serve Danny well in future stories!

    I can't wait for the next issue!

    -Pav, who is a happy comic reader these days...
    I agreee with much of what you said here Pav! I am loving Brisson take on Iron Fist. I feel he gives Iron Fist a sense of realness but while also keeping a layer of levity about him, which helps the reader to recongize him in which era of Iron Fist you are more confortable with.

    I also feel the fight could have been slightly longer but I also understand that Brisson wanted to display Iron Fist's chi abilities in full force.Great feat with the healing (possibly at Wolverine speed now) but it decreased the scene with the Wolf. So that leaves me torn a bit.

    I too enjoyed Brisson use of Continuity. So far this run feels like the next chapter in a book. Which I feel more comics should be mimic. Rewarding the readers for keeping with each run before but still keeping it fresh for those maybe new to the character. Thats what this medium is all about.

    Anyway, I can't wait for the next issue and more importanly Brisson take on Shang-Chi. He has always been a character that has inteiged me. I'm also sorta hoping Shang still has that duplication ability he gained in the Avengers. It seemed like such a great fit for that character.

    Anyone thing Iron Fist and Shang-Chi will have a classic stand off against each other? And if so who do you think will win, now that Shang may still be able to mutiple himself.
    Last edited by DragonsChi; 07-08-2017 at 09:46 AM.

  3. #2013
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    Just found time to sit down to read Iron Fist #5 and I got to say this issue was Epic! Danny was such an O.G. in this issue that I could barley contain myself while reading it. One thing that I really loved about this issue was that seemed like a love song to die hard Danny Rand fans. Almost as if the writer ,Ed Brisson, made it his mission to lock down and forever lock in that Danny Rand deserves his mantel. With all the recent "Twitter Press" dealing with the netflix show and previous writers leaving doubt of Danny's worth Brisson all but said "Quiet that noise Danny Rand is Iron Fist, so deal with it!".

    I could kiss that man right now, Im so happy!
    I hear ya bro. As I mentioned in my post, Iron Fist fans, especially on this thread, have been accomodating to the critics. I for one was supportive of Danny Rand being played by whomever, and the possibility of someone else taking the Iron Fist title.

    But saying that Danny doesn't deserve to be Iron Fist because he's an outworlder? Danny proved to be Iron Fist right here.

    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    Now that I read the issue I took the time to read the reviews and I must say Long and Atlantis you have excellent insight on the issue.

    I agreee with much of what you said here Pav! I am loving Brisson take on Iron Fist. I feel he gives Iron Fist a sense of realness but while also keeping a layer of levity about him, which helps the reader to recongize him in which era of Iron Fist you are more confortable with.

    I also feel the fight could have been slightly longer but I also understand that Brisson wanted to display Iron Fist's chi abilities in full force.Great feat with the healing (possibly at Wolverine speed now) but it decreased the scene with the Wolf. So that leaves me torn a bit.

    I too enjoyed Brisson use of Continuity. So far this run feels like the next chapter in a book. Which I feel more comics should be mimic. Rewarding the readers for keeping with each run before but still keeping it fresh for those maybe new to the character. Thats what this medium is all about.
    For me, I'm fine with the length of the fight. Actually, I think the fight went pretty long. For me, the "fight" included The One's explanation, the dialogue, and the betrayal in addition to the martial arts. All of that took a majority of the issue. Thus, it felt meaty and weighty.

    The fight showed Danny's resolve and his willingness to persevere. It wasn't Kung Fu pretty at all, but really raw and emotional. Come to think of it, that display actually corresponds to what we've seen with Danny, like his fight with the Chi-Lin Swierczynski's run or the entirety of the Andrews' issues. So, again props to Brisson for acknowledging continuity!

    Y'know the more I read this issue, the more I enjoy it. For instance, I noticed this one panel that focuses on Divine Wolf's face when he sees Chosin betray Danny. That's a great moment. It makes me realize that Divine Wolf has his honor.

    At the same time, I can't help but draw parallels between Divine Wolf and Davos. Both are very tied to K'un Lun and have their grudges against outworlders, namely Orson and Danny. What would happen if these two meet?

    Anyway, I can't wait for the next issue and more importanly Brisson take on Shang-Chi. He has always been a character that has inteiged me. I'm also sorta hoping Shang still has that duplication ability he gained in the Avengers. It seemed like such a great fit for that character.

    Anyone thing Iron Fist and Shang-Chi will have a classic stand off against each other? And if so who do you think will win, now that Shang may still be able to mutiple himself.
    I'm intrigued too. I hope there is a rivalry between the two. Brisson hinted at in his interview:

    Marvel.com: What kind of dynamic can we expect between these two characters? How does Danny feel about this team-up, especially one with the son of an internationally infamous criminal mastermind?

    Ed Brisson: These two are supposed to be the top kung-fu masters in the Marvel U and I think that there’s a mutual respect between them, however, we wanted to play off that a little. We’ve got them competing a little, even if it’s low key and not at the forefront. There are comments here and there that let you know that they’re both aware that the other is perhaps trying to outperform the other. As to Shang-Chi’s dad being an infamous criminal mastermind, it’s not something that is addressed. Danny knows that everyone’s got their own issues. Hell, Danny’s own father tried to kill him in Iron Fist: Living Weapon, so he’s not one to start criticizing some else’s parents.
    There's always been a mutual respect between Danny and Shang, but we fans can't help who is truly the better of the two. Personally, it all comes down to the iron fist. No chi powers, a straight up match, Shang's going to win. I'm completely confident in saying that because Shang has trained longer and is more disciplined that Danny. But with powers? Even if Shang could multiple himself, he can't take someone who can knock out a Hulk:



    Or take down a helicarrier:
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  4. #2014
    Astonishing Member Of Atlantis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tien Long View Post

    There's always been a mutual respect between Danny and Shang, but we fans can't help who is truly the better of the two. Personally, it all comes down to the iron fist. No chi powers, a straight up match, Shang's going to win. I'm completely confident in saying that because Shang has trained longer and is more disciplined that Danny. But with powers? Even if Shang could multiple himself, he can't take someone who can knock out a Hulk:
    Personally think in a straight up H2H, it's Shang-Chi 7-3/6-4, but including powers, I think it's Danny 8-2.

    I was reading up on fighting styles not too long ago to properly assess the upcoming Mayweather/MacGregor fight and found an interesting video of MMA fighters vs. One Style masters. The MMA fighters seem to have a sizable edge across the board, though with Shang-Chi's Kung-fu, I feel like it covers enough fighting styles to make up for it despite Danny knowing multiple arts. There is something to be said that Shang is also knowledgable in multiple arts outside of Kung-Fu as well. Sometimes knowledge truly is power. Also, I agree that Shang is much more disciplined. Danny is definitely more loose, I feel, and would especially be more loose fighting a friendly rival than someone like Davos.
    Currently Reading: DC: Mr. Miracle /// MARVEL: Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, Astonishing X-Men, Moon Knight, Spirits of Vengeance /// IMAGE: Renato Jones Season 2: Freelancer, Seven to Eternity, God Complex, Port of Earth

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  5. #2015
    Y'know. Pav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tien Long View Post
    At the same time, I can't help but draw parallels between Divine Wolf and Davos. Both are very tied to K'un Lun and have their grudges against outworlders, namely Orson and Danny. What would happen if these two meet?
    Even though I was at first thinking of Divine Wolf in relation to Prince of Orphans, the parallels between Wolf and Davos dawned on me too.

    Perhaps, if Danny seeks to rebuild K'un Lun, he would ask Davos to be the new One?

    -Pav, who likes when Davos isn't full-evil...
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  6. #2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pav View Post
    Even though I was at first thinking of Divine Wolf in relation to Prince of Orphans, the parallels between Wolf and Davos dawned on me too.

    Perhaps, if Danny seeks to rebuild K'un Lun, he would ask Davos to be the new One?

    -Pav, who likes when Davos isn't full-evil...
    I dunno, after Davos basically helped raze K'un L'un after being entrusted to guard Shou Lao's egg, I think he's beyond redemption. Actually kind of like him being a savage villain. Feel like there's too many gray villains lately. Davos has a lot of potential for becoming a solid threat in NYC.
    Currently Reading: DC: Mr. Miracle /// MARVEL: Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, Astonishing X-Men, Moon Knight, Spirits of Vengeance /// IMAGE: Renato Jones Season 2: Freelancer, Seven to Eternity, God Complex, Port of Earth

    Upcoming Reading: MARVEL: Gambit & Rogue, X-Men: Red, Dr. Strange: Damnation, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye /// IMAGE: Frontier

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  7. #2017
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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonsChi View Post
    Just found time to sit down to read Iron Fist #5 and I got to say this issue was Epic! Danny was such an O.G. in this issue that I could barley contain myself while reading it. One thing that I really loved about this issue was that seemed like a love song to die hard Danny Rand fans. Almost as if the writer ,Ed Brisson, made it his mission to lock down and forever lock in that Danny Rand deserves his mantel. With all the recent "Twitter Press" dealing with the netflix show and previous writers leaving doubt of Danny's worth Brisson all but said "Quiet that noise Danny Rand is Iron Fist, so deal with it!".

    I could kiss that man right now, Im so happy!
    I think that Brissen went a step further in that he had Danny face and defeat "The One" again to show that he is truly worthy of the mantle of The Iron Fist. I really enjoyed this story. I wasn't so sure of the premise in the beginning because how many stories have we seen when Danny loses his ability to summon the Iron Fist? I was thinking, "Not this story again." Then I thought that this gauntlet was a less epic version of the Great Heavenly Cities Tournament but what Brisson did was give us a Martial Arts Iron Fist story. Not a corporate drama as with the Netflix show, but an actually martial arts action drama. It was the book that I was looking forward to read the most in the past few months. I am looking forward to seeing what Brisson has in store for Danny and Shang Chi in his Kung Fu horror story.

  8. #2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Of Atlantis View Post
    Personally think in a straight up H2H, it's Shang-Chi 7-3/6-4, but including powers, I think it's Danny 8-2.

    I was reading up on fighting styles not too long ago to properly assess the upcoming Mayweather/MacGregor fight and found an interesting video of MMA fighters vs. One Style masters. The MMA fighters seem to have a sizable edge across the board, though with Shang-Chi's Kung-fu, I feel like it covers enough fighting styles to make up for it despite Danny knowing multiple arts. There is something to be said that Shang is also knowledgable in multiple arts outside of Kung-Fu as well. Sometimes knowledge truly is power. Also, I agree that Shang is much more disciplined. Danny is definitely more loose, I feel, and would especially be more loose fighting a friendly rival than someone like Davos.
    I think it is far more interesting if it is ambiguous as who is truly the better fighter between the two. With his chi Shang "should not" have a chance if Danny is written correctly. Danny would be too fast, strong and technical. He can greatly increase his physical abilities (strength, speed and reflexes) and that was before Orson's chi and "The Book of the Iron Fist." I felt that Danny would be more technical in some aspects of martial arts technique but Shang would be better at using various weapons. Shang has been written as being better focused than Danny and a more accomplished instructor--various character have specifically gone and trained with Shang. I always felt that Danny's Kung Fu should be unique since it derives from K'un- Lun and not regular earth. As for knowing various styles, Danny is a master of various fighting styles from earth. But as I wrote earlier, it is far more interesting when it is a bit ambiguous as who is the better fighter. That said Danny is by far the more interesting character since it is my opinion that writers have not truly delved into Shang and given his character layers. The classic marvel way is to give a character flaws and that has not been the case with Shang.

  9. #2019
    Y'know. Pav's Avatar
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    I'm in the midst of my annual goal of trying to read as much as possible during these summer months, and today I basically read all of the Immortal Iron Fist straight through. Tomorrow I hope to read all of The Living Weapon, and then I'll re-read the first arc of the current series. Here are some random thoughts from latest read-through of IIF:

    1) The character of Prince of Orphans and his role in relation to all of the Cities of Heaven is perplexing. On the one hand, we got that conversation between the Thunderer and PoO, in which John Aman indicated he knew secrets of K'un Lun - like why Davos had been passed over as champion. Yet he knew nothing of the Eighth City. So yeah: his backstory, and what he knows, is of supreme interest to me.

    2) I found it interesting that, at one point, the Thunderer comments that K'un Lun has been on the brink of revolution for some time, and (I'm paraphrasing) is caught in a fight between its past and its future; then, when Danny is freeing the Eighth City, says that maybe K'un Lun doesn't deserve to stay standing if it can't accept its past. Considering what happens during The Living Weapon, well... you can see why these comments caught my eye.

    3) I wonder if we'll ever get any follow-up on the child of the Iron Fist Slayer.

    4) The "modern" Iron Fist comics have been mostly caught up in the past/mythos of the Iron Fist: on explaining how the events of the 20th century led to Danny becoming the Iron Fist. I can't help but think that, eventually, it's going to be necessary to turn our attention not to the past, but to the future; and I think Pei is going to play a big role in that future.

    I'm excited to move right into The Living Weapon and see how these series tie together in ways I may have missed before. For example:

    5) At the very end of IIF, after being tortured in hell, Danny comments that he is lying to his friends: he is not okay. Tonally, these final stories do lead into TLW more cleanly than perhaps we gave Kaare credit for.

    -Pav, who wishes Misty would've had that baby...
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  10. #2020

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    I adored Lucy, Danny and Misty's kid from the Secret Wars Romance anthalogy issue. She even had an iron fist plushie yo (big Danny/misty shipper here).

    I thought the prince of orphan's name conflicted with Dog Brother 1 since orphans were his domain.

    I dont know if we'll get any follow up on the iron fist slayer child; a cameo at best.
    Last edited by the illustrious mr. kenway; 07-11-2017 at 05:03 AM.

  11. #2021
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    Quote Originally Posted by the illustrious mr. kenway View Post
    I adored Lucy, Danny and Misty's kid from the Secret Wars Romance anthalogy issue. She even had an iron fist plushie yo (big Danny/misty shipper here).

    I thought the prince of orphan's name conflicted with Dog Brother 1 since orphans were his domain.

    I dont know if we'll get any follow up on the iron fist slayer child; a cameo at best.
    I completely forgot about the Iron Fist slayer's child.

    Prince of Orphans alluded more to the lost spirits of the dead rather than actual orphans, I figured. He seems to deal with a lot of deceased. Would love to see him explored further, all the immortal weapons, really.
    Currently Reading: DC: Mr. Miracle /// MARVEL: Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, Astonishing X-Men, Moon Knight, Spirits of Vengeance /// IMAGE: Renato Jones Season 2: Freelancer, Seven to Eternity, God Complex, Port of Earth

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  12. #2022
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Of Atlantis View Post
    Personally think in a straight up H2H, it's Shang-Chi 7-3/6-4, but including powers, I think it's Danny 8-2.

    I was reading up on fighting styles not too long ago to properly assess the upcoming Mayweather/MacGregor fight and found an interesting video of MMA fighters vs. One Style masters. The MMA fighters seem to have a sizable edge across the board, though with Shang-Chi's Kung-fu, I feel like it covers enough fighting styles to make up for it despite Danny knowing multiple arts. There is something to be said that Shang is also knowledgable in multiple arts outside of Kung-Fu as well. Sometimes knowledge truly is power. Also, I agree that Shang is much more disciplined. Danny is definitely more loose, I feel, and would especially be more loose fighting a friendly rival than someone like Davos.
    Quote Originally Posted by taozen View Post
    I think it is far more interesting if it is ambiguous as who is truly the better fighter between the two. With his chi Shang "should not" have a chance if Danny is written correctly. Danny would be too fast, strong and technical. He can greatly increase his physical abilities (strength, speed and reflexes) and that was before Orson's chi and "The Book of the Iron Fist." I felt that Danny would be more technical in some aspects of martial arts technique but Shang would be better at using various weapons. Shang has been written as being better focused than Danny and a more accomplished instructor--various character have specifically gone and trained with Shang. I always felt that Danny's Kung Fu should be unique since it derives from K'un- Lun and not regular earth. As for knowing various styles, Danny is a master of various fighting styles from earth.
    Good points about Shang and Danny in terms of personality. They can compliment one another well, with Shang being disciplined and Danny being more impulsive and loose (though there have been hints here and there throughout the last decade or so of Shang of developing his personality. He can be very Zen-like, but he can also enjoy singing at a karaoke bar. But I digress, that's best reserved for the Shang-Chi thread).

    In terms of fighting.....are there any good issues of Danny or Shang that describe their training outside of their base styles? Like, outside of the arts of K'un Lun, what else has Danny studied? Outside of Kung Fu, what else has Shang studied? I think that could be a good story arc, both martial artists expanding their repertoire of techniques.

    Still, Of Atlantis and taozen raises a good points about both Shang and Danny. They align with some of my own beliefs. Shang's Kung Fu offers versatility. Now before anything else, I just want to mention the recent uproar that occurred in China when an MMA fighter completely annihilated a Tai Chi master.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/10/w...a-tai-chi.html.

    Kung Fu can be limited, but it's also very diverse. Officially, as recognized by the government, there are something like 500+ styles of Chinese martial arts. Factor in the variations that each master, family, and school have on a style, there could be thousands. I guarantee you these styles cover the MMA principles of kicking, punching, clinching, locks, sweeps, and grappling. And it's safe for me to assume that Shang, through his knowledge of these arts, knows all of these principles very well. He may not have studied as highly in Muay Thai or BJJ, but he probably knows their principles and mastered those principles since they can be found in the Chinese arts. Thus, if there were a fight between Danny and Shang and Danny would try to use BJJ or Judo on Shang, Shang could counter.

    Ultimately, in terms of skill, the advantage that Danny has, as taozen mentioned, is his training in K'un Lun. That is an extradimensional style of which Shang has no experience. K'un Lun's fighting style is probably very similar to the Chinese ones, but there are going to be unique techniques. That's the only way I think Danny could beat Shang skillwise.

    But as I wrote earlier, it is far more interesting when it is a bit ambiguous as who is the better fighter. That said Danny is by far the more interesting character since it is my opinion that writers have not truly delved into Shang and given his character layers. The classic marvel way is to give a character flaws and that has not been the case with Shang.
    Yeah, for all of my own thoughts concerning who's the better fighter, I'd like that to be kinda TBD, right? As for characterization, you're right Danny is more interesting, but I believe Shang could be developed. There have been glimmers of a new developed personality over the last couple of years. I liked his show of personality in the Totally Awesome Hulk series. But there are still aspects of Orientalism here and there. I know there's a way for Shang to be rooted in traditional Chinese beliefs and culture without going into fortune cookieism.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pav View Post
    Even though I was at first thinking of Divine Wolf in relation to Prince of Orphans, the parallels between Wolf and Davos dawned on me too.

    Perhaps, if Danny seeks to rebuild K'un Lun, he would ask Davos to be the new One?

    -Pav, who likes when Davos isn't full-evil...
    Quote Originally Posted by Of Atlantis View Post
    I dunno, after Davos basically helped raze K'un L'un after being entrusted to guard Shou Lao's egg, I think he's beyond redemption. Actually kind of like him being a savage villain. Feel like there's too many gray villains lately. Davos has a lot of potential for becoming a solid threat in NYC.
    I think Andrews mentioned Davos' characterization in an interview once, stating that someone who as born bad would continue to stay bad. He's been given chances to be good, and has squandered them, in pretty spectacular fashion. Still, could be redeem himself from this? Part of me wants that.

    It would be cool if Iron Fist got a Vegeta and Davos might be it .

    Speaking of the One, something about Shu-Hu makes me think he could become the new Thunderer. It would be great if he were a part of the rebuilding of K'un Lun.
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  13. #2023
    The Celestial Dragon Tien Long's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taozen View Post
    I think that Brissen went a step further in that he had Danny face and defeat "The One" again to show that he is truly worthy of the mantle of The Iron Fist. I really enjoyed this story. I wasn't so sure of the premise in the beginning because how many stories have we seen when Danny loses his ability to summon the Iron Fist? I was thinking, "Not this story again." Then I thought that this gauntlet was a less epic version of the Great Heavenly Cities Tournament but what Brisson did was give us a Martial Arts Iron Fist story. Not a corporate drama as with the Netflix show, but an actually martial arts action drama. It was the book that I was looking forward to read the most in the past few months. I am looking forward to seeing what Brisson has in store for Danny and Shang Chi in his Kung Fu horror story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pav View Post
    I'm in the midst of my annual goal of trying to read as much as possible during these summer months, and today I basically read all of the Immortal Iron Fist straight through. Tomorrow I hope to read all of The Living Weapon, and then I'll re-read the first arc of the current series. Here are some random thoughts from latest read-through of IIF:

    1) The character of Prince of Orphans and his role in relation to all of the Cities of Heaven is perplexing. On the one hand, we got that conversation between the Thunderer and PoO, in which John Aman indicated he knew secrets of K'un Lun - like why Davos had been passed over as champion. Yet he knew nothing of the Eighth City. So yeah: his backstory, and what he knows, is of supreme interest to me.

    2) I found it interesting that, at one point, the Thunderer comments that K'un Lun has been on the brink of revolution for some time, and (I'm paraphrasing) is caught in a fight between its past and its future; then, when Danny is freeing the Eighth City, says that maybe K'un Lun doesn't deserve to stay standing if it can't accept its past. Considering what happens during The Living Weapon, well... you can see why these comments caught my eye.

    3) I wonder if we'll ever get any follow-up on the child of the Iron Fist Slayer.

    4) The "modern" Iron Fist comics have been mostly caught up in the past/mythos of the Iron Fist: on explaining how the events of the 20th century led to Danny becoming the Iron Fist. I can't help but think that, eventually, it's going to be necessary to turn our attention not to the past, but to the future; and I think Pei is going to play a big role in that future.

    I'm excited to move right into The Living Weapon and see how these series tie together in ways I may have missed before. For example:

    5) At the very end of IIF, after being tortured in hell, Danny comments that he is lying to his friends: he is not okay. Tonally, these final stories do lead into TLW more cleanly than perhaps we gave Kaare credit for.

    -Pav, who wishes Misty would've had that baby...
    Pav, thanks for mentioning this! It's difficult to reconcile all these disparate aspects of Danny's personality, so it's pretty cool someone is trying to. And yeah, again, I want to read about Pei. I hope that she is the future of the Iron Fist legacy and K'un Lun. And I would love, LOVE to see Danny play the mentor role in that. I know that Danny could give Pei a martial arts upbringing that she wouldn't be able to get in K'un Lun. I've said it before, I'll say it again, I'll keep championing it, Danny knows the best martial artists in the Marvel Universe. Colleen Wing, Shang-Chi, Black Widow, Black Panther, Elektra, Daredevil, Hawkeye, Captain America, I could see every one of these heroes becoming a teacher to Pei with Danny tying it all together for her.

    I pray, PRAY that Kaare Andrews has read some of my posts and is taking this into account as he writes his series.

    Quote Originally Posted by Of Atlantis View Post
    I completely forgot about the Iron Fist slayer's child.

    Prince of Orphans alluded more to the lost spirits of the dead rather than actual orphans, I figured. He seems to deal with a lot of deceased. Would love to see him explored further, all the immortal weapons, really.
    Yeah, me too concerning the slayer's child. That would be a cool thread for a story. Perhaps he'll get to meet Pei? Maybe they'll fight one another for the Iron Fist title? Keeping the iron fists crossed!
    "I am a man of peace."

    "A man of peace...who fights like ten tigers."

  14. #2024
    Astonishing Member Of Atlantis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tien Long View Post
    Good points about Shang and Danny in terms of personality. They can compliment one another well, with Shang being disciplined and Danny being more impulsive and loose (though there have been hints here and there throughout the last decade or so of Shang of developing his personality. He can be very Zen-like, but he can also enjoy singing at a karaoke bar. But I digress, that's best reserved for the Shang-Chi thread).

    In terms of fighting.....are there any good issues of Danny or Shang that describe their training outside of their base styles? Like, outside of the arts of K'un Lun, what else has Danny studied? Outside of Kung Fu, what else has Shang studied? I think that could be a good story arc, both martial artists expanding their repertoire of techniques.

    Still, Of Atlantis and taozen raises a good points about both Shang and Danny. They align with some of my own beliefs. Shang's Kung Fu offers versatility. Now before anything else, I just want to mention the recent uproar that occurred in China when an MMA fighter completely annihilated a Tai Chi master.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/10/w...a-tai-chi.html.

    Kung Fu can be limited, but it's also very diverse. Officially, as recognized by the government, there are something like 500+ styles of Chinese martial arts. Factor in the variations that each master, family, and school have on a style, there could be thousands. I guarantee you these styles cover the MMA principles of kicking, punching, clinching, locks, sweeps, and grappling. And it's safe for me to assume that Shang, through his knowledge of these arts, knows all of these principles very well. He may not have studied as highly in Muay Thai or BJJ, but he probably knows their principles and mastered those principles since they can be found in the Chinese arts. Thus, if there were a fight between Danny and Shang and Danny would try to use BJJ or Judo on Shang, Shang could counter.

    Ultimately, in terms of skill, the advantage that Danny has, as taozen mentioned, is his training in K'un Lun. That is an extradimensional style of which Shang has no experience. K'un Lun's fighting style is probably very similar to the Chinese ones, but there are going to be unique techniques. That's the only way I think Danny could beat Shang skillwise.
    I read about that MMA fighter destroying that Tai Chi master. That fight wasn't even close, though i wouldn't rank Tai Chi as one of the most offensive heavy martial arts. It was wildly arrogant of the Tai Chi master to think he could win imo.

    We saw not too long ago a spar between Shang-Chi and Steve Rogers. Steve's fighting style is very heavily influenced by Judo, which is notably one of the most effective martial arts as far as MMA fighting is concerned. Steve ended up winning that round pretty handily, and tbh it isn't wildly out there that a judo would have certain advantages over kung-fu (and vice-versa of course). That, and it was only one round. Anyone with any MMA experience, having watched it or trained themselves, would know it was just a spar. For all we know, Shang was trying to develop a technique to be able to counter that fighting style.

    However, it does possibly show how effective a possibly unfamiliar fighting style could be. That said, Iron Fist's style, if anything, would likely resonate closer to kung-fu than judo, unless there have been extensive training in K'un L'un akin to something like it, which has never really been fully explored so I'm inclined to believe it hasn't.

    I think I'm overanalyzing it. This is starting to feel like a Joe Rogan fight companion lol
    Currently Reading: DC: Mr. Miracle /// MARVEL: Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, Astonishing X-Men, Moon Knight, Spirits of Vengeance /// IMAGE: Renato Jones Season 2: Freelancer, Seven to Eternity, God Complex, Port of Earth

    Upcoming Reading: MARVEL: Gambit & Rogue, X-Men: Red, Dr. Strange: Damnation, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye /// IMAGE: Frontier

    Trade Waiting: IMAGE: East of West, Black Road, The Black Monday Murders /// DARK HORSE: Hellboy, Witcher /// DYNAMITE: John Wick

  15. #2025
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    Iron Fist had a really disappointing showing in today's Defenders. His portrayal was the one thing I was most worried about being under Bendis's pen and it only took three issues for something completely demeaning and discrediting to happen to him lol
    Currently Reading: DC: Mr. Miracle /// MARVEL: Iron Fist, Dr. Strange, Astonishing X-Men, Moon Knight, Spirits of Vengeance /// IMAGE: Renato Jones Season 2: Freelancer, Seven to Eternity, God Complex, Port of Earth

    Upcoming Reading: MARVEL: Gambit & Rogue, X-Men: Red, Dr. Strange: Damnation, Tales of Suspense, Old Man Hawkeye /// IMAGE: Frontier

    Trade Waiting: IMAGE: East of West, Black Road, The Black Monday Murders /// DARK HORSE: Hellboy, Witcher /// DYNAMITE: John Wick

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