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  1. #76696
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    First, the serious...

    https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/x...not-a-movement

    Hillary Clinton Is Not a Movement

    She came within a hair of becoming president, but what does the 2016 nominee have to offer Democrats now?

    Anyone who has ever had their life upended suddenly knows the temptation of turning the disaster over and over again in your mind. Could you have done something differently? Are you to blame for your own distress? Who is in the wrong? You may remind yourself that these questions don't matter—what counts is the here and now, the choices you make going forward. Even so, that temptation to diagram the causes of your downfall, the bad breaks, the proof that actually the universe is unfair—it's almost inescapable.

    Yes, this is about the Democrats. Like a tongue compulsively probing a rotten tooth, portions of the party seem unable to resist re-litigating the 2016 election. With Hillary Clinton's campaign recap, What Happened, dropping next week, a certain amount of stone-casting was probably inevitable. That doesn't make it any less ugly. With the presidential contest coming down, in the end, to just tens of thousands of votes in the Midwest, Clinton's loss had plenty of causes: the American electorate's inherent sexism, Russian hacking of Democrats that resulted in a wave of leaked emails and negative news stories, Trump's appeal to white voters angry at both parties, Republican suppression of Democratic-leaning voters, FBI Director James Comey's public criticism of Clinton even as he declined to prosecute her for using a personal email for government business, Clinton's failure to campaign aggressively in states like Michigan—the list goes on.

    But Clinton partisans have tended to emphasize a divisive primary as the reason she fell short, and Clinton herself has sounded hostile notes toward Bernie Sanders. Passages from What Happened that blame Sanders for doing "lasting damage" to her campaign by challenging her from the left during primary season. The anti-Sanders torch is being carried chiefly by Verrit, a vaguely defined website founded by longtime Clinton booster Peter Daou and endorsed by Clinton herself, that launched this week. In a post titled "Sanders and the Mainstream Media Helped Put Trump in the White House," Daou blames the Vermont democratic socialist for the fact that "more than 20% of Sanders voters did not vote for Hillary Clinton in the general election" before bizarrely declaring that "the debate over what took place in 2016 is about the future, not the past."

    If the discussion about Democratic politics is about the future, though, Hillary Clinton is not going to be a part of that discussion.

    Clinton's campaign was based mostly on a broad ideological message but on the idea that she deserved the White House. Not that she was short on causes or policy prescriptions, but the argument for her candidacy was that she was uniquely qualified for the presidency. This was a good argument. But it makes efforts to convert her campaign to a long-term political force awkward to say the least. Democrats interested in subsidized college or universal healthcare have Sanders. Those concerned about corporate power have Elizabeth Warren. Criminal justice reform? Cory Booker. Want to see a woman—finally—in the White House? Warren or Kamala Harris or Kirsten Gillibrand offer you hope. What unique crusade can Clinton, or Verrit, for that matter, lead? Anyone who was "with her" has no shortage of new champions to look to. What does she still have to offer?

    Losing a presidential election puts a politician in a strange place. John McCain had a Senate career to fall back on after 2008, but most recent runners-up haven't had that plan B. Bob Dole, after crashing and burning against Bill Clinton in 1996, retired from political life and later appeared in a Pepsi ad. Mitt Romney faded from the limelight after 2012 but came back to endorse Republicans in 2014 and denounced Trump last year—for all the good that did.

    Maybe the best model for Hillary Clinton is Al Gore, who suffered a similar heartbreaker in 2000 after also winning the popular vote. Just as Clinton promised to continue Barack Obama's legacy, Gore represented a continuation of the Bill Clinton administration. Gore, however, was able to reinvent himself as an activist fighting climate change—a longtime pet issue of his that nevertheless wasn't a major part of the presidential campaign.

    Could Clinton make a similar transformation? Of course. But before she does, Democrats have little reason to listen to her or her proxies. To win in 2018 and 2020 the party will have to figure how to bring aboard some of those Sanders voters disenchanted by mainstream Democratic politics. They'll have to stand in opposition to Trump while also defining their own message on issues ranging from healthcare to the minimum wage to immigration. They'll also have to take a hard look at what Clinton did wrong—something hardcore acolytes like Dauo obviously have little interest in doing.

    After an avalanche of defeats in state and national elections, Democrats actually have a pretty good shot at digging themselves out, thanks in no small part to being able to contrast themselves with Trump's trainwreck of a presidency. For that rebuilding to take place, though, the party has to move on from rehashing the past. What happened? is an interesting question. What happens now? is the more important one.

  2. #76697
    Horrific Experiment JCAll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheInvisibleMan View Post
    anything more severe and theyll start eating each other
    Well, it's cheaper than buying a couple hundred cans of baked beans.

  3. #76698

  4. #76699
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Now, the not-so serious...

    http://www.theonion.com/article/clin...g-blame--56870

    Clinton Already Working On Follow-Up Book Casting Blame For Failures Of First

    CHAPPAQUA, NY — Saying it would provide a candid account of her experiences writing an unsuccessful tell-all, sources confirmed Thursday that Hillary Clinton is already working on a follow-up book casting blame for the failures of her previous memoir What Happened. “From my agent negotiating that underwhelming deal with Simon & Schuster, to the graphic designer’s lackluster cover art, to my so-called supporters who couldn’t be bothered to drop $17.99 for the hardcover copy—everyone had a hand in undermining my last book’s success,” reads a passage from the introduction to Clinton’s What Also Happened, which repeatedly decries her prior book’s “indecipherable” font and dedicates an entire chapter to lashing out at her copy editor for making her look like “an idiot third-grader.” “I’ll never forget how Amazon buried me and how Barnes & Noble completely sabotaged me by displaying my book way in the back in that no man’s land by the CDs. Frankly, it’s obvious I got screwed on all sides.” Accusing them of stealing her spotlight, the book reportedly concludes with a long list of every other celebrity who published a memoir in the past year.

  5. #76700

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    I'm familiar with some of those stories, but my take on this action isn't so much 'good thing' as it is 'a broken clock is still right twice a day'.
    There are indications it's a systematic problem, rather than just a handful of crazy anecdotes.

    The new rules are iron-clad, and the incentives are clear. Colleges are sticking with the policies even when they're at financial risk due to all the lawsuits.

    And while some college administrators express concern about due process, that concern does not always appear to be top of mind, even though lawsuits are piling up. Some 170 suits about unfair treatment have been filed by accused students over the past several years. As KC Johnson, the coauthor, with Stuart Taylor, Jr., of the recent book, The Campus Rape Frenzy, notes, at least 60 have so far resulted in findings favorable to them. The National Center for Higher Education Risk Management, one of the country’s largest higher-education law firms and consulting practices specializing in Title IX, recently released a white paper, “Due Process and the Sex Police.” It noted that higher-education institutions are “losing case after case in federal court on what should be very basic due process protections. Never before have colleges been losing more cases than they are winning, but that is the trend as we write this.” The paper warned that at some colleges, “overzealousness to impose sexual correctness”—including the idea that anything less than “utopian” sex is punishable—“is causing a backlash that is going to set back the entire consent movement.” Even so, in a February op-ed, Carol Quillen, the president of Davidson College, wrote that while “criminal justice is founded on due process and the possibility of innocence,” ideals she valued, these goals were inherently in conflict with other important goals: “Nothing about due process says to a rape survivor, ‘I believe you,’” she wrote.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  6. #76701
    Postmania Champion Gryphon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    There are indications it's a systematic problem, rather than just a handful of crazy anecdotes.

    The new rules are iron-clad, and the incentives are clear. Colleges are sticking with the policies even when they're at financial risk due to all the lawsuits.
    Reason magazine looked at every claim she made about Title IX and every insane and crazy case she said happened because of it.....................they all actually happened

    https://reason.com/blog/2017/09/07/d...ple-cases-rape
    Last edited by Gryphon; 09-07-2017 at 08:47 PM.

  7. #76702
    Class 5 Roaming Vapor BeastieRunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spike-X View Post
    So what's her excuse?
    She votes for the better person ... as long as it's a Republican. 😕
    "Always listen to the crazy scientist with a weird van or armful of blueprints and diagrams." -- Vibranium

  8. #76703
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Lensman View Post
    I reserve the right to be critical if she blames Sanders and everything not Clinton for her loss last November - It's past time to stop laying blame, especially in a way that will divide the only people really standing up to Benedict Donald right now.
    I agree. Clinton's been in "woe is me" mode since November. I'm long past tired of her and hoped she'd never show her face in public again after the election. You just KNOW she'll blame EVERYONE but herself and her shitty strategy for having lost to THE most unprepared and unqualified candidate ever to become president. Clinton just needs to go the fuck away!

    **********

    Who Do Conservatives Blame For Donald Trump’s Bad Deal? Paul Ryan, Of Course!

    Deals are Donald Trump’s art form, unless it’s a bad deal, in which case Paul Ryan is to blame. Looks like Eddie Munster is in a bad place right now. Excellent, Mr. Renfield! EX-cellent!

    **********

    Major Earthquake Strikes Off Southern Coast Of Mexico, Killing 5

    It was the strongest earthquake to hit the country since 1985.

    **********

    High School Students Disciplined After Wearing KKK Hoods, Burning Cross

    The students’ principal says the imagery doesn’t represent the community. THIS is what Mango Mussolini's support for white supremacists has wrought.

    **********

    Police Dispute Michael Bennett’s Claims Of Racial Profiling, Brutality

    “I see no evidence that race played any role in this incident,” a police official said. Well, of course he would say that. Pathetic!

    **********

    Equifax Says Hack Potentially Exposed Details Of 143 Million Consumers

    The company said criminals had accessed details including names, social security numbers, and, in some cases, driver’s license numbers.
    Avatar: Here's to the late, great Steve Dillon. Best. Punisher. Artist. EVER!

  9. #76704
    Invincible Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tami View Post
    Hillary Clinton will be interviewed by Rachael Maddow on Sept 14.

    And for anyone who is critical of this, let me remind you that we have had Bernie Sanders on News Programs over and over again for many months now. This will be one of Clinton's first/few TV interviews since the election.
    You do realize that Sanders is a current office holder being interviewed in that capacity, right?

    If he has been interviewed a bunch of times, there is an obvious and logical reason for that.

  10. #76705
    Queen Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    It's been almost a year since the election and Hillary Clinton has only had a few minor forays back into the public eye.

    WPP, seriously your attitude is one that is one you should reconsider. Why do you assume that Clinton's book is going to be her blaming everyone but herself? Have you read it yet? Have you any evidence this will be the case? Or, dare I say, are you making this assumption for less rational reasons?

    Every politician writes books. They all have a story to tell, experience to share. Why should Clinton be silent? Don't you think that, in order to do better in the future we need to take a look back at least once?

    Personally, I don't think that the Democrats should run blindly into 2018 and 2020 without confronting what happened in 2016. To do so, the one person who has the most clearest view of events is going to be the one who was right in the thick of it.

    All views of the events of 2016 should be considered, it was definitely one of the strangest elections we have had in decades. And possibly one of the most telling regarding the future of American democracy.

    And #30:

    As for Sanders, sure Congress members get interviewed on TV news all the time. But usually it is because they are part of Committees involved in whatever is being discussed, or they are sponsors of legislation that is in the news, or events are happening in their home states that are significant.

    And sure, politicians get on shows like The Late Show. Mostly it happens because they are promoting books they wrote or something similar.

    Sanders, he hasn't written a book and as far as I can tell he isn't on any investigative committee. So, why is he being interviewed far more often than just about any other politician?
    Last edited by Tami; 09-08-2017 at 07:21 AM.
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  11. #76706
    Queen Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    In regards to #30's post about Clinton not being a movement....of course she isn't. She is a politician, not a cult leader and not someone seeking to make some kind of social upheaval/change. No politician should be leaders of movements, that implies leading only small or specific groups of people. They need to be leaders of all the people, of towns, cities, states, countries, not of movements. There is a difference.
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  12. #76707
    Queen Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    Hillary Clinton, in Book, Regrets Not Striking Back at James Comey

    “My first instinct was that my campaign should hit back and explain that Mr. Comey had badly overstepped his bounds,” she wrote in the book, her attempt to make sense of her electoral defeat by Donald J. Trump. But, she said, her campaign advisers talked her out of it, convincing her that it was better “to just let it go and try to move on.”

    “Looking back,” she concluded, “that was a mistake.”

    It is one of a catalog of mistakes — large and small — that Mrs. Clinton lists in a post-mortem titled “What Happened.” The book, published by Simon & Schuster and scheduled to come out on Tuesday, has provoked a mix of anticipation and dread from Democrats, many of whom are loath to revisit the election that vaulted Mr. Trump into the White House.

    Still, even a week before its publication date, “What Happened” has zoomed to the top of the Amazon best-seller rankings, attesting to the public’s enduring fascination with Mrs. Clinton. The New York Times obtained an advance copy.

    Unlike Mrs. Clinton’s last book, which chronicled her years as secretary of state and was meant to be a launchpad for her candidacy in 2016, this book is the work of someone no longer running for anything. From failing to frame a message that matched the restive mood of the electorate to failing to go after Senator Bernie Sanders more aggressively during the Democratic primaries, Mrs. Clinton accepts her share of blame for Mr. Trump’s astonishing upset.
    This doesn't sound like someone who is playing the blame game. Sounds like someone who is giving a thoughtful consideration of what happened, the good, the bad, the things she did wrong as well as observations on the election as a whole.
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  13. #76708
    Not a Newbie Member JBatmanFan05's Avatar
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    I like how McCain pointed out he didn't write a book when he lost in 2008. But Hillary has to keep her power (and boost the income) via continued relevance aka news cycles:

    “Maybe at the worst possible time, as we are fighting some of the most high-stakes policy and institutional battles we may ever see, at a time when we’re trying to bring the party together so we can all move the party forward — stronger, stronger together,” said Rep. Jared Huffman, a Democrat who represents a Northern California district. “She’s got every right to tell her story. Who am I to say she shouldn’t, or how she should tell it? But it is difficult for some of us, even like myself who’ve supported her, to play out all these media cycles about the blame game, and the excuses.”
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...mocrats-242419
    Last edited by JBatmanFan05; 09-08-2017 at 06:53 AM.
    Thank you America for voting for change.

  14. #76709
    Queen Empress of Earth Tami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBatmanFan05 View Post
    I like how McCain pointed out he didn't write a book when he lost in 2008. But Hillary has to keep her power via continued relevance aka news cycles:

    “Maybe at the worst possible time, as we are fighting some of the most high-stakes policy and institutional battles we may ever see, at a time when we’re trying to bring the party together so we can all move the party forward — stronger, stronger together,” said Rep. Jared Huffman, a Democrat who represents a Northern California district. “She’s got every right to tell her story. Who am I to say she shouldn’t, or how she should tell it? But it is difficult for some of us, even like myself who’ve supported her, to play out all these media cycles about the blame game, and the excuses.”
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...mocrats-242419
    Then again, McCain didn't have to deal with the issues that Hillary Clinton did in 2016. When McCain ran there was no talk of Russia Hacking the election. The situation was completely different. And if he had written a book, no one would have thought twice about it.

    As for timing, what better time than before the 2018 elections begin? Those who want to brush the 2016 election under the rug are as bad as those who say 'What Russia? Russia didn't do anything?'

    And again, the reflexive assumption that it is a 'Blame Game' before the book is even published yet.
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  15. #76710
    Fantastic Member Jackmando7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBatmanFan05 View Post
    I like how McCain pointed out he didn't write a book when he lost in 2008. But Hillary has to keep her power (and boost the income) via continued relevance aka news cycles:

    “Maybe at the worst possible time, as we are fighting some of the most high-stakes policy and institutional battles we may ever see, at a time when we’re trying to bring the party together so we can all move the party forward — stronger, stronger together,” said Rep. Jared Huffman, a Democrat who represents a Northern California district. “She’s got every right to tell her story. Who am I to say she shouldn’t, or how she should tell it? But it is difficult for some of us, even like myself who’ve supported her, to play out all these media cycles about the blame game, and the excuses.”
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...mocrats-242419
    I wonder if her book will talk in detail about the screw job they pulled on Bernie.

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