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  1. #46
    Mutant bat on terrigen Fuzzy Barbarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anduinel View Post
    It's not significantly cheaper for a publisher to produce a new issue of a digital comic, though. Everyone who contributed still has to be paid, and what costs are saved on printing and shipping are largely canceled out by whatever percentage the storefront owner takes out. So I don't see that making the digital comics cheaper is the way to go. But digital should have equivalent value to print, and I think that's where Marvel and DC fall down. If I buy a physical comic, I've bought the comic. Similarly, if I buy a comic from Image or some of the smaller publishers, I'm getting a DRM-free download of the book as a back-up. With Marvel and DC, if you "buy" the digital comic, all you're really doing is getting the publisher's permission to read it on that platform, you don't own anything. Marvel even does it a bit backward, imo, by giving out free digital codes -- it may add value to the physical copy, but it devalues the idea of the digital comic by turning it into a perk as opposed to a product worth purchasing on its own terms. So I can understand why some people would sooner trade-wait than go digital.
    It's weird that Marvel's own app has prices the same as Comixology's. I'd think that it'd be cheaper. I said what Is aid because apparently, printing and shipping are the main contributors to cost.

    When it comes to buying what amounts to a license... I'm fine with that. It's like with PC gaming and the advent of Steam; you don't really own any of the games, you just have a license to play them. But as long as the service doesn't screw itself, it's fine. I don't see any value in a .cbr file or anything, and I don't think a lot of people do. I don't know much people, in any hobby or medium, who do value having the files. The physical product? Yeah, there will always be people who prefer it, but a file? Eh...

    I have always found it strange that Marvel give digital codes away like that. I mean, it's a nice perk for some people I know, who like to HAVE the physical comic, but read on their commute and whatnot, but yeah... kinda devalues the digital comic, at least for those who would pay the same amount for a physical copy (in Australia, buying a $3.99 USD comic IS cheaper than its $8.50 AUD equivalent).
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  2. #47
    Veteran Member dancj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anduinel View Post
    It's not significantly cheaper for a publisher to produce a new issue of a digital comic, though.
    Yeah it is.

    The figures in these two links are for an indie creator, not Marvel and DC, but:
    http://www.jimzub.com/the-reality-of...-owned-comics/
    http://www.jimzub.com/okay-but-what-...igital-comics/

    These links show that for physical comics, the creator and publisher only actually pocket 11% of the retail price, whereas with digital comics they pocket 35% if the comic is bought through the iOS app (which you can no longer do for Comixology) and 50% if it is bought from the Comixology website. And unlike with print, those percentages will stay the same regardless of the price of the comic, so they could charge 1/4 - 1/3 of the price and still make more money per issue.

  3. #48
    Veteran Member Trey Strain's Avatar
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    Something I've noticed in business is that people will actually force you to charge them more money than you normally would. Paying a premium price makes people feel special, because (A), they can afford it, and (B), they think they're getting something that's really good.

  4. #49
    Veteran Member phantom1592's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobinFan4880 View Post
    Creators were paid less and print runs were higher.
    This is where I usually point the blame, and it's not a popular opinion.

    Years back we had some excellent writers and artists... but they were not celebrities. They were not 'art'. They were employees paid to do a job, and if it wasn't done on time and at cost... they were replaced with someone else.

    After the Image Revolt Artists and writers got a LOT more power and a lot more pay. Now a single writer or artist can hold a book (or company) hostage and the editors seem to bend over backward to keep them happy.

    And the prices have gone up. Like... WAY up. And honestly, in my opinion... the quality has gone down. Everyone is more interested in producing high art with meaningful stories that change the industry FOREVER.... and nobody is doing the bread and butter stories that gained all the fans in the first place.

    I miss the days when comics were less serious and more fun. Suitable for children and not only for the dark and gritty adults.

  5. #50
    Veteran Member Trey Strain's Avatar
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    I'll add that the companies probably have some reason to think that charging lower prices will result in lower overall revenues.

  6. #51
    Marquis de Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trey Strain View Post
    I'll add that the companies probably have some reason to think that charging lower prices will result in lower overall revenues.
    Some companies.

    There seems to be clear divide between Marvel and DC with regards to prices.
    And most of the independants lean more expensive, but their books tend to be also of superior quality, and with that I just mean the physical object, not the contents.
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  7. #52
    Veteran Member Trey Strain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Some companies.

    There seems to be clear divide between Marvel and DC with regards to prices.
    And most of the independants lean more expensive, but their books tend to be also of superior quality, and with that I just mean the physical object, not the contents.
    I mean that they all probably have some reason to think that if they lowered their pricing, they'd lose money.

  8. #53
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    To have cheap comics, dc has to find a way to find new customers. One way to do this is to produce higher quality graphic novels that do not require any background knowledge and to experiment with new material instead of the old nostalgia stuff. The nostalgia stuff has a very limited market.

  9. #54
    Junior Member NeathBlue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outside_85 View Post
    Because people cost money to employ.
    That's probably one of the main reasons the price seems so expensive compared to the 1970's... Back then artists weren't payed a lot, but today I'm guessing they earn good money.

    Anyone know how much comic book artists earn? I really haven't an idea but as I said, I'm guessing they're on good money.

  10. #55
    Collector of Worlds GreenLanternRanger's Avatar
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    Comics are more then fairly priced for the most part. Sure you may have the occasional ridiculous $5.99 price tag on one of Marvel's event books, but the average $2.99 or $3.99 price tag is more then fair for something that is much more entertaining, createive & well written then say an overpriced $59.99- $69.99 Video Game which you may end up just playing through once and then have it sitting on your shelf collecting dust for years.

    It's also less of a risk to spend 3-4 bucks on a comic then it is anything else. If you don't like a book you are only out three bucks. If you don't like a movie you go see at a theatre or one you buy on BD/DVD you are out anywhere from 13-30 bucks (depending on the price of the ticket weather you get anything at the concession, etc, how much the dvd/bd cost) and again much cheaper then a game.

    So yea, overall comics are a steal. You get (mostly) quality content for a reasonable price that even if you aren't sure about is much less a financial risk then anything else.

    So yea, overall it's a win-win.


    But that's just my 2-cents.
    .
    Last edited by GreenLanternRanger; 08-23-2016 at 09:27 PM.
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  11. #56
    Veteran Member Bogotazo's Avatar
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    I think you're grossly underestimating the time and effort it takes into writing a comic book. And you need more than two people. You need a writer, who gets the idea, develops a plot or story arc, writes out a script, and often matches the script with instructional rough panels. The writer runs it by the editor at different stages; the artist who draws it (which takes hours and hours), and often someone else does the inking, along with possibly a separate colorist and letterer. That's a lot of hours with a lot of people working. No doubt animated movies also have a (probably bigger) team of people working together, but as people have mentioned, the units sold account for a lot.

  12. #57
    Junior Member C_Miller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenLanternRanger View Post
    Comics are more then fairly priced for the most part. Sure you may have the occasional ridiculous $5.99 price tag on one of Marvel's event books, but the average $2.99 or $3.99 price tag is more then fair for something that is much more entertaining, createive & well written then say an overpriced $59.99- $69.99 Video Game which you may end up just playing through once and then have it sitting on your shelf collecting dust for years.

    It's also less of a risk to spend 3-4 bucks on a comic then it is anything else. If you don't like a book you are only out three bucks. If you don't like a movie you go see at a theatre or one you buy on BD/DVD you are out anywhere from 13-30 bucks (depending on the price of the ticket weather you get anything at the concession, etc, how much the dvd/bd cost) and again much cheaper then a game.

    So yea, overall comics are a steal. You get (mostly) quality content for a reasonable price that even if you aren't sure about is much less a financial risk then anything else.

    So yea, overall it's a win-win.


    But that's just my 2-cents.
    .
    I do kind of get what you're saying, but you do understand the issue of the cost per time unit, right? Let's say a movie is 2 hours. If you pay 10 dollars, that's about 5 dollars an hour. A DVD or BluRay would be more, but most BluRays come with extras and of course you own it and can rewatch it anytime. According to gamelengths.com, Fallout 4 takes about 150 hours to complete. If you pay 60 dollars that's 40 cents an hour. Not all games that that long to complete of course, but so many games do these days.

    Comics on the other hand are between 3 and 4 dollars. So we'll split the difference and say $3.50 and we'll be generous and say it takes you 20 minutes to get through a comic (which is definitely a liberal estimate). That comes out to over $10.60 per hour of entertainment, making it one of the more expensive entertainment costs outside of probably live events (music or theater). It would cost $21 to match the time it takes to watch a movie, to and $1500 to equal the time it would take to play Fallout.

    And you constantly repeat how comics are much more entertaining and high quality than video games or movies. Which is an unprovable point if I've ever seen one. There are great movies, there are great Video Games and of course there are great comics. Comics are no more likely to be of high quality than a good movie or video game, they're a form of media as any other.

    And you bring up the point of risk. An interesting point, but you seem to be mixing up two points. Yes, comics are much lower risk because they're only 3-4 dollars. In a macro sense, you're better off for reading comics because the cost is far less if you get a dud. However, the issue isn't that comics are a lower risk, the issue at hand is that they're not a great value. And that's the case when you compare to film and video games. It's an issue of your dollar not going as far when you use it to buy a comic.

  13. #58
    Collector of Worlds GreenLanternRanger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Miller View Post
    I do kind of get what you're saying, but you do understand the issue of the cost per time unit, right? Let's say a movie is 2 hours. If you pay 10 dollars, that's about 5 dollars an hour. A DVD or BluRay would be more, but most BluRays come with extras and of course you own it and can rewatch it anytime. According to gamelengths.com, Fallout 4 takes about 150 hours to complete. If you pay 60 dollars that's 40 cents an hour. Not all games that that long to complete of course, but so many games do these days.

    Comics on the other hand are between 3 and 4 dollars. So we'll split the difference and say $3.50 and we'll be generous and say it takes you 20 minutes to get through a comic (which is definitely a liberal estimate). That comes out to over $10.60 per hour of entertainment, making it one of the more expensive entertainment costs outside of probably live events (music or theater). It would cost $21 to match the time it takes to watch a movie, to and $1500 to equal the time it would take to play Fallout.

    And you constantly repeat how comics are much more entertaining and high quality than video games or movies. Which is an unprovable point if I've ever seen one. There are great movies, there are great Video Games and of course there are great comics. Comics are no more likely to be of high quality than a good movie or video game, they're a form of media as any other.

    And you bring up the point of risk. An interesting point, but you seem to be mixing up two points. Yes, comics are much lower risk because they're only 3-4 dollars. In a macro sense, you're better off for reading comics because the cost is far less if you get a dud. However, the issue isn't that comics are a lower risk, the issue at hand is that they're not a great value. And that's the case when you compare to film and video games. It's an issue of your dollar not going as far when you use it to buy a comic.

    I agree that quality or lack there of is unprovable, but how far you think your dollar goes is also unprovable. Sure you could judge by how much time a product consumes, but what if you feel that time was wasted? Again I think the value of anything depends on how much you as an individual enjoy it. You can spend 40 hours playing through a game, but if you stop having fun half way through did you really get your money's worth?

    But yea, at the end of the day it all depends on how much you care about the media you consume/purchase. Different things are worth more/less to different people.
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  14. #59
    Veteran Member cranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeathBlue View Post
    That's probably one of the main reasons the price seems so expensive compared to the 1970's... Back then artists weren't payed a lot, but today I'm guessing they earn good money.

    Anyone know how much comic book artists earn? I really haven't an idea but as I said, I'm guessing they're on good money.
    From what I recall it may or may not be a liveable wage, depending on the artist? Most artists probably dabble in other work and supplement their income by doing commissions. I know in the 80s selling original art was a crucial part of artists income, but I don't know what the policy on that is, also in the old days creators got paid more if comics sold more, but nothing has near the circulation numbers these days to warrant that.

  15. #60
    Elder Member Lee Stone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenLanternRanger View Post
    Comics are more then fairly priced for the most part. Sure you may have the occasional ridiculous $5.99 price tag on one of Marvel's event books, but the average $2.99 or $3.99 price tag is more then fair for something that is much more entertaining, createive & well written then say an overpriced $59.99- $69.99 Video Game which you may end up just playing through once and then have it sitting on your shelf collecting dust for years.

    It's also less of a risk to spend 3-4 bucks on a comic then it is anything else. If you don't like a book you are only out three bucks. If you don't like a movie you go see at a theatre or one you buy on BD/DVD you are out anywhere from 13-30 bucks (depending on the price of the ticket weather you get anything at the concession, etc, how much the dvd/bd cost) and again much cheaper then a game.

    So yea, overall comics are a steal. You get (mostly) quality content for a reasonable price that even if you aren't sure about is much less a financial risk then anything else.

    So yea, overall it's a win-win.


    But that's just my 2-cents.
    .
    I don't think there's a cut and dry way to figure out how much a comic should cost.

    These are the factors I think that are making a difference:

    1. Mainstream comics are overproduced. There's far too many people involved, which consumes the company's finances.

    2. There's little or no ad revenue. Think back to the 80s. There were ads every three or four pages. You still had anywhere from 20 to 26 pages of story, like you do now... but there were more companies buying ad space. Most don't now because most comics can't be considered 'appropriate' for the general public on a monthly basis. The last thing advertisers want is their product associated with something that could offend people without warning.

    3. More comics per month being pushed out by the Big Two. This splits your readership, as they have to pick and choose titles (which are already expensive). While there may be more readers overall, the growing number of titles reduces the number of readers per title.

    4. The speculator rebirth. 1:500 and 1:1000 variants and 25+variant covers per issue have drawn attention to aftermarket sales to people who don't even read comics. Slabbing comics has done more harm than good, as each comic is reduced to being nothing more than a plastic coated shingle of wood with a pretty cover image (note: save yourself money and print the cover out, put a piece of cardboard behind it and laminate it).
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