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  1. #31
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    Why not make it 2 parts? Release the parts that he has already written. So we can have something to read while he scribbles the rest of the story up.

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  2. #32
    Marquis de Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlitzMah View Post
    Why not make it 2 parts? Release the parts that he has already written. So we can have something to read while he scribbles the rest of the story up.
    Writers don't always, or usually, write their books in chronological order.
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Writers don't always, or usually, write their books in chronological order.
    Partly this and...if he writes something in the "second half" that necessitates a change in the "first half"...well...he wouldn't be able to do that.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by batnbreakfast View Post
    Does anybody know if one of GRRM's influences on ASoIaF was Frank Herbert's Dune (extreme weather/seasons, different houses)?
    Different "houses" is probably more influenced by the Middle Age feudal system than anything, which the general setting of ("medieval times") largely affects the series (and many "high fantasy" stories) anyway. It's not like Dune invented the idea...

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by abysslord View Post
    Well ... he sort of did the opposite. He stretched things out so much that entire books can be summarized in a few paragraphs. I remember someone calling WoT series "RPG fantasy" in that it's similar to the old RPGs where you had to wander around just to level up.

    So it's not quantity, it's quality. But I do agree something is wrong with George. I have a feeling he's either editing himself too much and being his own worst critic, constantly rewriting and never being happy until 5-6 years later .... or he's just lazy or slow. Either way, there's no way he will finish the books. He's not exactly the definition of healthy. He needs another 12 years to finish the series, I wouldn't bet on that with my money.
    "Lazy and slow". Hrmph. This is the fan entitlement we speak about.

    Why can't he just be "enjoying life the way he freaking wants to enjoy it"? ESPECIALLY if, as you imply, he doesn't have many years left to live. GRRM is entitled to his own personal bucket list if he so desires.

    Of course, also with the possibility of writer's block and/or over-editing/having high self-expectation.
    Last edited by Star_Jammer; 01-05-2016 at 08:36 AM.

  6. #36
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    EH Different Houses goes back way before the Middle Ages that is a classic since you have Nobility.

    I wouldnt consider AsoIaF High Fantasy, Magic is not nearly mainstream enough in my book.

  7. #37
    Veteran Member batnbreakfast's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    That's kind of broad... almost like having humans in it being an influence.
    I know and wouldn't mind. Similarities can happen. Confirmed influences are The once and future king and Ivanhoe there might be more.
    I love Dune AND Martin's epic. Harkonnen= Lannister, Atreides= Stark? That's where it starts. Could be worse influences.
    Last edited by batnbreakfast; 01-05-2016 at 10:11 AM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Jammer View Post
    "Lazy and slow". Hrmph. This is the fan entitlement we speak about.

    Why can't he just be "enjoying life the way he freaking wants to enjoy it"? ESPECIALLY if, as you imply, he doesn't have many years left to live. GRRM is entitled to his own personal bucket list if he so desires.

    Of course, also with the possibility of writer's block and/or over-editing/having high self-expectation.
    Well obviously it's his life to do with what he pleases but some professions demand a little give-and-take with your audience. After all, we helped him become financially stable by buying into a fantastic story so I don't think it's too entitled to want him to not drag us along at a much longer rate than other authors who write just as well. "Don't forget where you came from" type of thing.

    In reality if the people who hated him taking so long didn't give him any more money the system would kind of work itself out, but we know that doesn't happen. So in the end, yes he can take as long as he wants with almost no penalty so why not?

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Jammer View Post
    "Lazy and slow". Hrmph. This is the fan entitlement we speak about.

    Why can't he just be "enjoying life the way he freaking wants to enjoy it"? ESPECIALLY if, as you imply, he doesn't have many years left to live. GRRM is entitled to his own personal bucket list if he so desires.

    Of course, also with the possibility of writer's block and/or over-editing/having high self-expectation.
    Its his life so of course he has the right to take as long as he wants and do what he wants.

    However as one of his former customers I absolutely had the right to stop supporting him by not buying his books due to his snail writing pace. Thats my right just as its Martin's right to write at his own pace.

    Its why I now love the show much more than the books (I loved the first four when I read them but will not read another unless the series is finished). The show has a definite plan and end in sight while the books have no end in sight and a long trail of empty promises about when the next book might come.
    Last edited by JediMindTrick; 01-05-2016 at 04:26 PM.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by abysslord View Post
    Well obviously it's his life to do with what he pleases but some professions demand a little give-and-take with your audience. After all, we helped him become financially stable by buying into a fantastic story so I don't think it's too entitled to want him to not drag us along at a much longer rate than other authors who write just as well. "Don't forget where you came from" type of thing.

    In reality if the people who hated him taking so long didn't give him any more money the system would kind of work itself out, but we know that doesn't happen. So in the end, yes he can take as long as he wants with almost no penalty so why not?
    You didn't "help" him become financially stable; you purchased a product that he created, for whatever reasons are you own. That's where any and all obligation ends, on either party.

    Resorting to calling him "lazy" or "slow" (which are generally seen as words used to insult someone), without factually knowing that he is one or both, is selfish entitlement and reeks of "Waah, waah, I'm not getting my way". Period, the end.

    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTrick View Post
    Its his life so of course he has the right to take as long as he wants and do what he wants.

    However as one of his former customers I absolutely had the right to stop supporting him by not buying his books due to his snail writing pace. Thats my right just as its Martin's right to write at his own pace.

    Its why I now love the show much more than the books (I loved the first four when I read them but will not read another unless the series is finished). The show has a definite plan and end in sight while the books have no end in sight and a long trail of empty promises about when the next book might come.
    Yes, absolutely. You're not entitled to his penmanship, and he's not entitled to your money.

    What more needs to be said?

  11. #41
    New and Improved hulahulk's Avatar
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    Star Jammer, are you actually GRRM in real life? You're pretty passionate about all this. Valar Morghulis, etc, etc.
    Original join date: sometime in 2002

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by hulahulk View Post
    Star Jammer, are you actually GRRM in real life? You're pretty passionate about all this. Valar Morghulis, etc, etc.
    I'd say I'm no more or less passionate than the people rawr-hating "whur r muh bookz" and making sly insults at an author, but to each their own.

  13. #43
    Veteran Member RobinFan4880's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlitzMah View Post
    Why not make it 2 parts? Release the parts that he has already written. So we can have something to read while he scribbles the rest of the story up.

    o-MAISE-570.jpg
    RA Salvatore has often talked about how he has basically written an entire book before but towards the end he added a new character that he wound up really liking, so he went back and re-wrote whole sections of the book to include the new character.

    That's an arduous process and Salvatore is not writing intricate tomes the way Martin is.

    Plus, part 1 and part 2 both need to be complete, stand alone books. You would need to massively rewrite both to give them a satisfying beginning, middle and ending.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Jammer View Post
    You didn't "help" him become financially stable; you purchased a product that he created, for whatever reasons are you own. That's where any and all obligation ends, on either party.

    Resorting to calling him "lazy" or "slow" (which are generally seen as words used to insult someone), without factually knowing that he is one or both, is selfish entitlement and reeks of "Waah, waah, I'm not getting my way". Period, the end.
    Let's use a different word then. How about frustrated? We're paying for him to continue this story and he's taking a long time. From reading his blog and listening to him talk it seems like he puts off writing a lot. Of course no one really knows what's going on, he could be writing 5 hours a day and just needs rewrites or whatever. But from our window I think we can call him lazy or slow, again, because other writers seem to be able to pull this off.

    At the end of the day, if you publish your writing you're trying to get people to pay you for it. If they do, I think there's a little obligation there to continue in a timely matter for a serial story. Not a 100% slavery thing, just a polite courtesy of at least saying "Thank you for your patience". Similar to comics. You put it out when you can, but if you take years to put out a comic when many others can do so monthly or 10 times a year, you begin wondering if it's an effort thing.

    Anyway, of course you're right when you break it down and he owes us nothing. I'm just arguing in the gray area.

  15. #45
    Marquis de Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by abysslord View Post
    Let's use a different word then. How about frustrated? We're paying for him to continue this story and he's taking a long time.
    And how money have you paid him to continue the story? And I do not mean how money you paid him to purchase his already written books. Really just money you donated with nothing in return except a promise of a relatively speedy continuation?
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

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