Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 29 of 29
  1. #16
    Spectacular Member GhostPirate's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    211

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LifeIsILL View Post
    I'd rather have it like this than the Claremont dialogue-heavy way. Reading the Claremont X-Men or Simonson's Thor run was a chore simply because the excessive amount of unnecessary CRAP (not exposition, crap) the characters would spout. It adds nothing to the story and is an insult to readers.
    That "crap" was actually this thing once known as "character development", and people complaining about writers using their words to tell a story being referred to as "readers" is, ironically, actually more of an insult to readers.

  2. #17
    Astonishing Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,567

    Default

    Though obviously it doesn't start there, I would say a big turning point was Ultimate Spider-Man, which set out to make "decompression" part of its whole strategy. The first arc took an origin story that took 10 pages to tell and spent 4 issues on it. And instead of turning people off, it actually came off as a fresh approach to storytelling at a company that was known up till then for a rather old-fashioned writing style (and was still using very compressed storytelling in most of its flagship books).

    Soon after USM launched there was a management shakeup at Marvel and Joe Quesada came in with a mandate to modernize the writing style at the company, so USM became a sort of model for how Marvel comics should be written, and the old compressed style became rare at Marvel, while DC was already moving in that direction.

  3. #18
    Astonishing Member Nick Miller's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,348

    Default

    When writers started writing 3,4, or 5 books a month. Along with tv/film projects, and maybe a job too.

    Come up with one story, and write the dialogue for 6 months. Sooo much work!

    Correct me if im wrong, but simonson, claremont, wein, wolfman, gaiman, f miller, moore
    These guys worked on one book at a time, maybe 2. Enough time to craft a story.

  4. #19
    Astonishing Member Nick Miller's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    2,348

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by GhostPirate View Post
    That "crap" was actually this thing once known as "character development", and people complaining about writers using their words to tell a story being referred to as "readers" is, ironically, actually more of an insult to readers.
    Along with thought bubbles and narration, which drew the reader into the world.

    Imagine reading a novel or short story, and its all dialogue, lol

  5. #20
    Incredible Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    765

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Miller View Post
    Along with thought bubbles and narration, which drew the reader into the world.

    Imagine reading a novel or short story, and its all dialogue, lol
    Except that comics are inherently different from prose. The art of the comic is a dynamic part of the storytelling process. Comics that rely heavily of thought balloons or narrator captions ofter are just relaying information that should be clear from the art. For instance, how many comics have you read where the characters are explaining their powers as they are using them? Or describing the action as it is occurring? TV tropes has section on "Talking is a free action" and "Wall of Text" to show examples of how they can be used poorly.

    The skill of the writer can minimize these weaknesses or bypass them all together. PeterDavid, Roger Stern, or Fabian Nicieza can write a character or story (done in one or serialized) that can appeal to any type of reader.

    Also remember that some of the greatest stories from any period are the longer stories. Stories like the Dark Phoenix Saga, Demon in a Bottle, or the original Hobgoblin story are all done over many issues. I would also say that it would be impossible to tell those stories in a single issue and have them be nearly as effective.

  6. #21
    Incredible Member RumpusMagoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    509

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    Though obviously it doesn't start there, I would say a big turning point was Ultimate Spider-Man, which set out to make "decompression" part of its whole strategy. The first arc took an origin story that took 10 pages to tell and spent 4 issues on it. And instead of turning people off, it actually came off as a fresh approach to storytelling at a company that was known up till then for a rather old-fashioned writing style (and was still using very compressed storytelling in most of its flagship books).

    Soon after USM launched there was a management shakeup at Marvel and Joe Quesada came in with a mandate to modernize the writing style at the company, so USM became a sort of model for how Marvel comics should be written, and the old compressed style became rare at Marvel, while DC was already moving in that direction.
    I would agree with you, but I'd also add that the 90's art style of splash pages and cool posing also contributed to a slowing down of story, as well as downgrading the medium of the sequential art that made it famous.

  7. #22
    Fantastic Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    470

    Default

    Writing for the trade -- put it on Marvel's doorstep. They have the bad habit of taking something that sticks and driving it through the ground. Bendis has always written for collections, even when he was small press. This worked for Marvel. Trades boomed. So, corporate-think says everything must have a 5 or 6 issue story arc even if the story content isn't meaty enough. Sometimes it's okay to have a six issue trade with a 3-parter, 2-parter and a 1-shot or whatever combination. Justice Society did whatever combination as did Jonah Hex.

  8. #23
    Mighty Member Gaastra's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,273

    Default

    Carl barks scrooge comics. In 10 pages he told more story then 5 comics combined today!

  9. #24
    Amazing Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    70

    Default

    I always figured mainstream heroes were story lite, like action movies that they were. I think it was the B heroes that got heavy stories because writers could take them where A-listers wouldn't be allowed to go. And that along with our "Understanding Comics" over time gave them depth and made them big. It's pretty evolved now...

  10. #25
    Not a Newbie Member JBatmanFan05's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Arkham, Mass (lol no)
    Posts
    7,064

    Default

    Writing for the trade is the culprit and I hope more push back on it in various ways like:

    1) it's written for trade, but each issue packs more story
    2) or each trade starts to contain 2-3 or more shorter arcs
    Last edited by JBatmanFan05; 03-15-2018 at 08:53 AM.
    Thank you AMericA for votinG for chAnge.

  11. #26
    Concerned Citizen Citizen Kane's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Amongst the people
    Posts
    389

    Default

    I think a lot of this dead space can be attributed to the lack of experience and skill within the comic book workforce; which becomes especially apparent when a sizable portion of these workers are involved with companies and titles that have high-exposure rates. Perhaps, the general conception is that story doesn't attract readers, flashy images do, which allows for sub-par creators to enter the industry, saving the big companies a few bucks and allowing them to meet their bare-minimum requirements for quality.

  12. #27
    multiple choice Orion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Deadworld
    Posts
    543

    Default

    I think what we think of as "modern decompressed writing" pretty much started with The Authority, The Ultimates, and Ultimate Spider-man. All three are of course modern classic masterpieces, but people learned the wrong lessons from them or just lazily copied their structure without giving us their content.

  13. #28
    Mighty Member My Two Cents's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    1,208

    Default

    I would say Stan Lee gave birth to it between 1966-1967.
    For the first few years Marvel was putting in a lot of panels and words into there comics
    and than suddenly there was less panels (along with more splash pages) and a lot
    less words. That continued for a few years and than gradually saw more words and less
    slash pages as other writers took over the books.

  14. #29
    Fantastic Member
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    470

    Default

    Dump this on Marvel's doorstep. They are the biggest offender when it comes to driving something that works into the ground. For the longest time, they have accumulated writers who either not ready for prime time; writing for single volume graphic novel which is expensive for (at least) $3.99 an issue (chapter); or writers coming from or aspiring to get into other media (TV/novels) and don't understand the comic book medium (i.e. the visuals are important, too).

    I've held onto Daredevil but I've generally dumped Marvel for their content quality. I'll pick up a collection here or there (Superior Foes, Fraction/Aja Hawkeye) that passes the smell test. New 52 zapped DC for me. I've dipped my toe back in for specific characters, but, haven't reconnected with the company. DC, however, has managed to get a little bit of money out of me since Rebirth.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •