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  1. #1
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    Default Rebirth: What's the End Game?

    So, what is being brought back exactly? Past continuity? Actual legacy or the simple feeling of legacy? Optimism?

    Do you guys actually think this will lead to a confrontation between the DC heroes and DM whereby everything is fixed? Or will DC just leave it as a dangling thread never to be addressed again?

    What ar your thoughts?
    Favorite Characters/Teams: Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), Batman, Spider-Man, The Fantastic Four, the Justice League (both pre- and post-Flashpoint versions)

    Favorite Writers: Geoff Johns, Scott Snyder, Mark Waid, Jonathan Hickman, Nick Spencer, Jason Aaron, Rick Remender

    Favorite Artists: Ben Oliver, Doug Mahnke, Andrea Sorrentino, Jae Lee, Jesus Saiz, Ivan Reis, Aaron Kuder, Jason Fabok, Ryan Sook, Russel Dauterman, Esad Ribic

  2. #2
    Titans Together!! byrd156's Avatar
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    The end game is a better product, it's about bringing back the stuff that makes DC DC.
    "It's too bad she won't live! But then again, who does? - Gaff

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrd156 View Post
    The end game is a better product, it's about bringing back the stuff that makes DC DC.
    Yeah, but specifically. How will Rebirth set about doing that? Is this ALL we've seen of the mystery of "what happened to those missing 10 years?" or does DC have an event or story arc planned that addresses that issue further?
    Favorite Characters/Teams: Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), Batman, Spider-Man, The Fantastic Four, the Justice League (both pre- and post-Flashpoint versions)

    Favorite Writers: Geoff Johns, Scott Snyder, Mark Waid, Jonathan Hickman, Nick Spencer, Jason Aaron, Rick Remender

    Favorite Artists: Ben Oliver, Doug Mahnke, Andrea Sorrentino, Jae Lee, Jesus Saiz, Ivan Reis, Aaron Kuder, Jason Fabok, Ryan Sook, Russel Dauterman, Esad Ribic

  4. #4
    Marquis de Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrd156 View Post
    The end game is a better product, it's about bringing back the stuff that makes DC DC.
    Yep, they got rid off a Superman I liked to bring back a Superman I didn't like from the past.

    Just like pre-New 52 DC did with Green Arrow, Green Lantern, The Flash... Feels more like proper DC already.
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

  5. #5
    Veteran Member GlennSimpson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    So, what is being brought back exactly?
    Lost sales.
    For the love of God, people, just put "In my opinion..." at the beginning of your posts so that we can stop wasting bandwidth arguing about whether someone was trying to express a fact or not.

  6. #6
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    There will obviously be a story about bringing back the lost 10 years so there will be more retcons or reboots, but it will not be identical to pre flashpoint.

  7. #7
    Veteran Member sifighter's Avatar
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    I'm sure they some sort of really big event planned down the line involving the Watchmen and Wally West but honestly it's probably just DC saw that sales weren't doing as well as they wanted them to be with DCyou and decided that they would try to go back to more classic looking versions of the characters but keep what has been working while also trying to tell some interesting stories, which has worked in my opinion.
    "It's fun and it's cool, so that's all that matters. It's what comics are for, Duh."
    Words to live by.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Yep, they got rid off a Superman I liked to bring back a Superman I didn't like from the past.
    I think the same thing.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlennSimpson View Post
    Lost sales.
    Yes, because New 52 was selling so well. Oh, wait...
    Favorite Characters/Teams: Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), Batman, Spider-Man, The Fantastic Four, the Justice League (both pre- and post-Flashpoint versions)

    Favorite Writers: Geoff Johns, Scott Snyder, Mark Waid, Jonathan Hickman, Nick Spencer, Jason Aaron, Rick Remender

    Favorite Artists: Ben Oliver, Doug Mahnke, Andrea Sorrentino, Jae Lee, Jesus Saiz, Ivan Reis, Aaron Kuder, Jason Fabok, Ryan Sook, Russel Dauterman, Esad Ribic

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Yep, they got rid off a Superman I liked to bring back a Superman I didn't like from the past.

    Just like pre-New 52 DC did with Green Arrow, Green Lantern, The Flash... Feels more like proper DC already.
    There was literally nothing to like about New 52 Superman.
    Favorite Characters/Teams: Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), Batman, Spider-Man, The Fantastic Four, the Justice League (both pre- and post-Flashpoint versions)

    Favorite Writers: Geoff Johns, Scott Snyder, Mark Waid, Jonathan Hickman, Nick Spencer, Jason Aaron, Rick Remender

    Favorite Artists: Ben Oliver, Doug Mahnke, Andrea Sorrentino, Jae Lee, Jesus Saiz, Ivan Reis, Aaron Kuder, Jason Fabok, Ryan Sook, Russel Dauterman, Esad Ribic

  11. #11
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    I hope it will be an all out assult with the combined forces of the DC Universe with Superdad in the front vs Dr Manhattan.

    And for the record Superdad is the superiour Superman over Nuperman

  12. #12
    Veteran Member GlennSimpson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    Yes, because New 52 was selling so well. Oh, wait...
    Well, sales of the new52 the first couple of years were great, and while they gradually declined they never reached the low they were at before the new52. But there came a time when they needed another boost as both companies do from time to time, so they figure out an angle ("bring back legacy and hope") and decided to bring back a few of the characters/situations that some people were bitching about losing and put a big old "event" stamp on it and it worked, and last month was the biggest comics sales month in 20 years.

    You might not like it, but these are the things that sell comics.
    For the love of God, people, just put "In my opinion..." at the beginning of your posts so that we can stop wasting bandwidth arguing about whether someone was trying to express a fact or not.

  13. #13
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    I think the endgame is ultimately to re-focus on what makes the heroes the DCU and the DCU as a whole great and unique, as well as re-establish characters, relationships, and groups who have been absent for far too long while course-correcting characters who've gone off the rails or stopped resembling who they used to be when fans grew to love them.

    I think with all the Watchmen references and teases that have been in multiple books, some more subtle then others, there's some kind of plan or culmination still in the works.

  14. #14
    Veteran Member Atlanta96's Avatar
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    DC realized the New 52 broke their universe. People were not responding well to the changes they made and the overall tone and stories of the new DCU. And they were losing sales because of the New 52. So they made a checklist of all the major fan complaints, everything most people seemed to hate about the rebooted universe and are trying to fix those problems. It's paying off on the sales charts so theyre doing the right thing.

    We don't know exactly how much of Pre-Flashpoint DC will be restored. But they're doing their best to make the current DCU look and feel like the old one, so it doesn't even matter that much how much history is restored, even though I want as much Pre-Flashpoint stuff as possible.

  15. #15
    Junior Member Jadeb's Avatar
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    How Rebirth is playing out in Green Arrow is telling, I think. Essentially, that book has reverted the Ollie and Dinah dynamic to the pre-52 status -- they've known each other for three issues but they're already star-crossed lovers fated to be together. It's implausible within the story, but it's essentially DC doing what it wants with the characters to get them to a viable status quo. So Rebirth is DC having its cake and eating it too, even if short-term continuity suffers. Bits and pieces of the New 52 worked, and they get to stay, as do sales-friendly updates such as adding Cyborg to the Justice League to add diversity. Otherwise, we're reverting back to classic states as DC deems convenient (and the market supports).

    I do wonder if this is leading to yet another reboot. With comics in the state they're in, that may be inevitable based solely on sales, but some of the storytelling makes me think the seeds are already being planted. Somehow we'll end up with one Superman, and he will be native to the universe he's in. But whether that fix will be contained within his books or result from a major Watchmen saga, we'll have to see.

    Really, my suspicion is that there's no end game other than seeing what moves books and going with that. Right now, what's winning is a sunnier, more classic version of the DC universe with a much larger cast of characters. And I'm all for that.
    Last edited by Jadeb; 07-23-2016 at 10:03 AM.

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