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  1. #1
    hate cant reach you here Endsong's Avatar
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    Default What origin would you give Donna Troy in Rebirth?

    Donna Troy has been a big question ever since the Finches reintroduced her during their run on Wonder Woman. She was a mysterious Amazon with a body of clay, only related to Diana by the fact that her genes were effectively the same as Hippolyta's, and was ostensibly a villain that was meant to take the role of the Queen of Amazon's from Diana by the villainous Derinoe - the problem was, where had his Donna come from? Derinoe's dialogue within the series implied that she was basically a newborn, even going so far as to use a newborn Amazonian baby in her creation, but given the other Amazon's familiarity with her this couldn't have been the case.

    And now, we know that what happened during the past two runs of Wonder Woman were "lies." The Themyscira that was introduced in Azzarello's run and introduced the concept of Diana as queen was a lie, and it did not truly exist in the same capacity as the true Themyscira - something that we were introduced to during the Year One storyarc by Greg Rucka with art by the wonderful Nicola Scott. Donna, however, was not a lie. We've already seen with her inclusion in an upcoming miniseries that neither was Hessia, but her origin is being hashed out for the first time. Donna is a big question mark though; who is she and what is her connection to Diana? At least part of this will be cleared up in the Titans annual, but that's a few months away from now. So a question: how would you explain Donna Troy?

    For me, it's actually kind of simple. Diana came to Man's world about ten years ago, and we haven't seen her ENTIRE life during Year One - so just do the easy thing and make it so that Donna Troy is the younger sister of Princess Diana of Themyscira; Donna of Themyscira, second daughter of Hippolyta, adopted if not through their genes. She's a few years younger than Diana, but the gap isn't as large as it would appear in current continuity. Donna looked up to her older sister Diana, and when she left the island of Themyscira, she was heartbroken. Against her mother's wishes, five years after Diana left Themyscira, a sixteen year old Donna left as well, and headed for Man's World. When she got there, her nearly identically aged sister was now seven years older than her as opposed to the usual two.

    She decides to start fighting crime with Diana, in Diana's honor, as Wonder Girl. She joins up with the Teen Titans. The rest is, as they say, history.

    "I've never felt the world so angry. So divided. I can hear you. I can hear your pain. Your fear. Your anxiety. I want to help. I don't know how, but I'll learn." - X-Men Red #1(2018)

  2. #2
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    I'd just go with the original idea of her parents dying in a fire and being adopted by Hippolyta and Diana.

  3. #3
    The Comixeur Mel Dyer's Avatar
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    I'd like to see a slight variation of Donna's original origin, in which the burning building was changed into a burning ocean liner or an 18th century sailing ship, ..or still some other kind of sea-going vessel that conveniently carried her into the time-lost world of the Amazons. Then, infant Donna Troy gets conveniently rescued from the burning ship, by young Princess Diana or Queen Hippolyta, and taken to Paradise Island, where she's raised among the Amazons!

    The rest is history.

    Simple, classic, superhero origin story...with no Titans of Myth. No Dark Angel. We need that, again. Donna needs it, again - an origin you can finish in one breath.
    Last edited by Mel Dyer; 01-11-2017 at 03:49 AM.
    FINALLY! The greatest comic book movie, ever made... The ORIGIN of the GOLDEN AGE WONDER BOY!

  4. #4
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    Titans, due to the shortage of time Diana has actually been in Mans World, that she's now never actually been home, and to explain why Donna is so much more powerful than your average Amazon.

  5. #5
    Incredible Member Lokimaru's Avatar
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    Wasn't the True Wonder Girl Origin that of a Mirror clone of a Younger Diana, what's so bad about that. It's like you guys just pick and chose what you want to be cannon by who writes it. If it's someone you like it's cannon and if it's someone you don't you gleefully chuck their work in the shredder (Then set the shredder on fire).

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lokimaru View Post
    Wasn't the True Wonder Girl Origin that of a Mirror clone of a Younger Diana, what's so bad about that. It's like you guys just pick and chose what you want to be cannon by who writes it. If it's someone you like it's cannon and if it's someone you don't you gleefully chuck their work in the shredder (Then set the shredder on fire).
    I dislike what Byrne did with the mirror origins because it needlessly rewrote Donna's origins yet again, seemingly just because Byrne felt like it. Also... it was just kinda crap, I mean the story was that Magala the amazon mage conjured Donna out of Diana's mirror image so Diana would have a playmate... yet the effort is immediately hijacked by a villain and Donna is lost for several years and no one remembering she was ever there. And to top it all off most of this was done to accommodate Evil Donna aka Dark Angel... the least interesting of the 'Dark Wonder Woman' ideas that later gave us Devastation and Genocide.

    And as I mention, this was done at the drop of a hat, more or less. And the origins it replaced was the Titans origins crafted by Wolfman/Perez over in NTT, which had taken time and effort into explaining why Donna still remembered the fire origins even though it couldn't possibly have happened and provided a serviceable reason why Donna was as powerful as she was and what the Titans needed her for. After that story, I would have thought everyone had gone: "Right! Everything is sorted with Donna's origins now!" And Byrne went: "Nope, here is my take!" And we were back in the chaos yet again. Also let me point out Byrne has been, till now it seems, the only Wonder Woman writer to ever associate Ares as a father to one or more of the Amazons (either going by myth and have it be Hippolyta or give Artemis an unknown wrinkle), which he did when he wrote Genesis.

  7. #7
    Fantastic Member Joao's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mel Dyer View Post
    I'd like to see a slight variation of Donna's original origin, in which the burning building was changed into a burning ocean liner or an 18th century sailing ship, ..or still some other kind of sea-going vessel that conveniently carried her into the time-lost world of the Amazons. Then, infant Donna Troy gets conveniently rescued from the burning ship, by young Princess Diana or Queen Hippolyta, and taken to Paradise Island, where she's raised among the Amazons!

    The rest is history.

    Simple, classic, superhero origin story...with no Titans of Myth. No Dark Angel. We need that, again. Donna needs it, again - an origin you can finish in one breath.
    That's a good origin! Especially now that we know Diana never returned to Themyscira after she first left.

    Maybe Diana trained Donna herself out of the island, who knows. That would actually be good to tie their stories together.

    And since new 52 Themyscira was fake, let's just forget that Donna ever existed.

  8. #8
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    Byrne was trying to restore some pre-Crisis concepts to Wonder Woman. The mirror Wonder Girl was a way of acknowledging Wonder Girl's true origin--in the Impossible Tales. All efforts to explain how Wonder Girl could exist were retcons, pre- and post-Crisis. I'm not sure why one of these origins has any more relevance than another.

    All of the origin stories for Donna have their problems and they just make my head hurt.

    I'd imagine a lot of writers would just want to chuck everything out and start with a clean slate. Give Donna a good origin story--one that isn't too boring, but can be explained in three sentences.
    The medium is the message. This is merely to say that the personal and social consequences of any medium
    --that is, of any extension of ourselves--result from the new scale that is introduced into our affairs by each extension of ourselves, or by any new technology.

    --Marshall McLuhan, Understanding Media: The Extensions of Man (McGraw-Hill, CANADA 1964)

  9. #9
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    I'm liking the whole Stands-with-a-fist idea. Kinda Tarzan-like. 5 year old Donna washes up on Themyscira, raised by Amazons. Follows sister. Joins Titans.

    No idea how she gets superpowers. Magic spell? Magic items?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    Byrne was trying to restore some pre-Crisis concepts to Wonder Woman. The mirror Wonder Girl was a way of acknowledging Wonder Girl's true origin--in the Impossible Tales. All efforts to explain how Wonder Girl could exist were retcons, pre- and post-Crisis. I'm not sure why one of these origins has any more relevance than another.
    You could argue that the first retelling of an origins is the defacto origins of a new continuity (like post-COIE) until a writer comes along and explains that it actually isn't and why isn't. What Byrne did however was done out of nostalgia, as you point out. He didn't bother with explaining why the ToM origins was suddenly not it, he just threw it out the window like it was never there and did his own thing. (Maybe feeling it was time Donna had an origins and actual connection to Diana for once?)

    Donna is problematic because you have several origins to choose from, some better explained and defined than others, most of which are only tangentially connected to Diana. Like the mirror origins isn't even Donna's origin, it's one of many explanations of how Diana the adult could go on adventures with both her mother, and two younger versions of herself.

  11. #11
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    The problem with the saved as a baby from a fire by WW origin was that it attached a timeline to Donna and Diana. In order for it to be true, Wonder Woman had to be around for about fifteen years (give or take). Which is fine, if Diana became Wonder Woman fifteen years ago or more, but not if her own origin suggests she was more recent. There's a built-in self-destruct in the origin that blows it up when writers try to tamper with either Diana or Donna's timelines.
    The medium is the message. This is merely to say that the personal and social consequences of any medium
    --that is, of any extension of ourselves--result from the new scale that is introduced into our affairs by each extension of ourselves, or by any new technology.

    --Marshall McLuhan, Understanding Media: The Extensions of Man (McGraw-Hill, CANADA 1964)

  12. #12
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    As long as her powers are essentially the same as Diana's and now her weaponry as well. Idk about her origin tbh. It's confusing but in the end she usually ends up an Amazon, somewhat related to Diana and has similar powers and weapons so whatever.

  13. #13
    Astonishing Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    I like the idea of the Mirror Image come to life for several reasons. It gives direct ties to Diana and Hippolyta. It shows that the Amazon's have their sorceresses and magicks. It also explains the similarities of looks, height and powers between Donna and Diana.

    The thing I don't like about a rescued child raised as an Amazon idea is the gaining of strength, stamina, agility, flight, etc. The girl could be raised in the culture, but would still be a mortal human child, and certainly not someone of near-WW caliber. And we know Donna is at that level.

  14. #14
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    Donna got her powers through Amazon technology in the original origin

  15. #15
    Astonishing Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Yeah, I know. But I don't like that one!

    And while it was just OK for the 1960's/70's, now it has to go. Donna needs a better origin, one that makes sense and fits all the pieces together.

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