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  1. #1156
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    I'm not sure it moves towards a finale, because you can always go in some sort of different direction. However, there is still the problem that the new direction isn't the thing that made the series popular in the first place.
    but there's only so many new directions a character can go before it stops being "that character" or make sense. in a way, i think concepts like dr who and the hulk are better built for the long term because they internally allow an expectation from the reader that the character will go through drastically different iterations.

    if a character moves in a "logical" character arc, they are moving towards closure and moving towards a finish.

    For example, when Peter retired and was replaced by Ben Reilly, that wasn't a finale for the title, since it could go on for hundreds of issues. But it wasn't what drew readers to Spider-Man in the first place.
    peter's story did move towards a finale whereas ben's picked up again. in that case, the title continues but one character's tale "ends". but i also really liked that move and thought it was clever and bold. clearly i was in the minority ha.
    Last edited by boots; 05-18-2017 at 05:04 PM.
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  2. #1157
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    Ultimate was the way forward.

    It just needs to be planned to allow for a period of phasing in the new version as the eventual "canonical" version while phasing the old version out.

    The way to really make Spider-Man exist in the same form for each generation is to reboot every 20 years or so. (And maybe don't kill Gwen for once. That's officially boring at this point.)
    this. seconded.
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  3. #1158
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    And absolutely no clones until the year 3000 when we're too dead to care

  4. #1159
    Fantastic Member Timmyb52's Avatar
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    Found this today on CBR...it definitely proves Quesada changed things up by OMIT.It still makes me wonder if Marvel will use the original words Mary Jane spoke to Mephisto as their "back door" to resolve OMD now that MJ is going to be back in the book and with all the telegraphing Marvel has been dping lately in the build up towards Legacy.
    To be totally honest...if everyone knows/assumes that the Fantastic Four is coming back...and this is the big reveal for Legacy, then how will that "break the internet"? The only thing that would "break the internet" when it comes to a Legacy reveal IMHO is the resolution to OMD and the reinstatement of the marriage.If DC is having so much success with Lois and Clark and all the other superhero characters they have in serious relationships in their books then why should Marvel be left behind?
    Perpetuating an outmoded and sexist anti-marriage stance is no longer logical nor makes any good business sense.
    A lot of women and girls are now reading and buying comic books and seeing superheroes in relationships...why would Marvel want to persist in leaving "money on the table"?
    Why continue to not utilize one of Marvel's most popular and famous female characters {MJ}, in the book {Amazing} that she was always meant to be a part of? And why continue to deny her place with Peter? The times are changing...and Marvel needs to drop this nonsensical,sexist anti-marriage stance ASAP...or be left behind!

    Comic Legends: What Did Mary Jane REALLY Say to Mephisto?

    http://www.cbr.com/spider-man-one-mo...jane-mephisto/
    Last edited by Timmyb52; 05-19-2017 at 07:59 PM.

  5. #1160
    Spam Hunter Conn Seanery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmyb52 View Post
    Found this today on CBR...it definitely proves Quesada changed things up by OMIT.It still makes me wonder if Marvel will use the original words Mary Jane spoke to Mephisto as their "back door" to resolve OMD now that MJ is going to be back in the book and with all the telegraphing Marvel has been dping lately in the build up towards Legacy.
    To be totally honest...if everyone knows/assumes that the Fantastic Four is coming back...and this is the big reveal for Legacy, then how will that "break the internet"? The only thing that would "break the internet" when it comes to a Legacy reveal IMHO is the resolution to OMD and the reinstatement of the marriage.If DC is having so much success with Lois and Clark and all the other superhero characters they have in serious relationships in their books then why should Marvel be left behind?
    Perpetuating an outmoded and sexist anti-marriage stance is no longer logical nor makes any good business sense.
    A lot of women and girls are now reading and buying comic books and seeing superheroes in relationships...why would Marvel want to persist in leaving "money on the table"?
    Why continue to not utilize one of Marvel's most popular and famous female characters {MJ}, in the book {Amazing} that she was always meant to be a part of? And why continue to deny her place with Peter? The times are changing...and Marvel needs to drop this nonsensical,sexist anti-marriage stance ASAP...or be left behind!

    Comic Legends: What Did Mary Jane REALLY Say to Mephisto?

    http://www.cbr.com/spider-man-one-mo...jane-mephisto/
    Seems like you're adding "sexist" to your comments to make your stance sound more important than it is. Unless you've got some quotes from people in the know/involved in the OMD decision stating the marriage ended because they don't like women or something, it doesn't make much sense. Women were still in the book post-OMD. Even MJ herself, to some degree.
    Last edited by Conn Seanery; 05-20-2017 at 12:52 AM.
    Conn Seanery
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  6. #1161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmyb52 View Post
    If DC is having so much success with Lois and Clark and all the other superhero characters they have in serious relationships in their books then why should Marvel be left behind?
    Because Marvel is having more success with a single Spider-Man than DC is with a married Superman.

  7. #1162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmyb52 View Post
    Comic Legends: What Did Mary Jane REALLY Say to Mephisto?

    http://www.cbr.com/spider-man-one-mo...jane-mephisto/
    I do have to wonder if this is going to be inserted back in...given what MJ whispered to OMIT doesn't make any sense in the context of Spidey/Deadpool's events. The deal still happened despite Mephisto insisting it didn't, and he didn't leave Peter alone per MJ's request.

  8. #1163
    Mighty Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    I do have to wonder if this is going to be inserted back in...given what MJ whispered to OMIT doesn't make any sense in the context of Spidey/Deadpool's events. The deal still happened despite Mephisto insisting it didn't, and he didn't leave Peter alone per MJ's request.
    I'm thinking that the Powers That Be are more worried about telling stories they want to tell and/or think are good one to tell rather than keeping continuity intact. (I honestly can see arguments for that being a good and bad thing.)

  9. #1164
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    I'm thinking that the Powers That Be are more worried about telling stories they want to tell and/or think are good one to tell rather than keeping continuity intact. (I honestly can see arguments for that being a good and bad thing.)
    I believe it was Drax writer CM Punk that said Marvel didn't care about continuity anymore too

  10. #1165
    Invincible Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    There's probably a better chance than ever before considering the success of Rebirth/Reborn Superman. So they could want to riff off that. But I don't see it happening as long as Slott is around.
    They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son. - Jor-El.

  11. #1166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    There's probably a better chance than ever before considering the success of Rebirth/Reborn Superman. So they could want to riff off that
    They could, but DC tend to get away with this sort of thing a lot easier because they're DC and salad tossing continuity is pretty much second nature to them. Plus they only had five years to dispose of with Rebirth/Reborn, Marvel since OMD have had a decade. A whole generation's grown up with devil dealing Peter Parker.

    The best solution you can hope for is Peter and MJ's memories of their marriage are restored, and the drama then lies in what they do from there. Ideally, I'd love the marriage to come with it, but, as Slott has said, it seems to be a decision that's above him, and one he had to fight for to gain mainstream representation again in a book aimed specifically at that audience and not as marketed as strongly. Restoring them as a couple with no legal bind is'nt out of the question however, and that definitely comes to Slott. I agree with you there that the chances there are slim what with his willingness to go against the grain.
    Last edited by Miles To Go; 05-20-2017 at 01:21 PM.

  12. #1167
    Invincible Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Considering its been so long, I'd be perfectly fine with them just getting back together and progressing again from there. I'm much more adamant Sins Past needs to be retconned over OMD, if I had to pick one.
    They can be a great people Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you. My only son. - Jor-El.

  13. #1168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Considering its been so long, I'd be perfectly fine with them just getting back together and progressing again from there. I'm much more adamant Sins Past needs to be retconned over OMD, if I had to pick one.
    Not wrong there. It would have been out with a lot of other things if JMS had gotten his way

  14. #1169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    There's probably a better chance than ever before considering the success of Rebirth/Reborn Superman. So they could want to riff off that. But I don't see it happening as long as Slott is around.
    The next writer will have as much power to change Spider-Man's marital status as Dan Slott does - zero.

    If Marvel wanted Spider-Man married again they'd do it, no matter who the writer is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Miles To Go View Post
    Not wrong there. It would have been out with a lot of other things if JMS had gotten his way
    Yeah, but he would've nuked "Death of Gwen Stacy" and 40 years of continuity with it.

    I don't think it's the right way to retcon Sins Past. It's not a "Gwen would never do that" retcon, it's a "timeline was altered so Gwen never had the opportunity to do that" retcon.

  15. #1170
    Incredible Member suemorphplus209's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    The next writer will have as much power to change Spider-Man's marital status as Dan Slott does - zero.

    If Marvel wanted Spider-Man married again they'd do it, no matter who the writer is.



    Yeah, but he would've nuked "Death of Gwen Stacy" and 40 years of continuity with it.

    I don't think it's the right way to retcon Sins Past. It's not a "Gwen would never do that" retcon, it's a "timeline was altered so Gwen never had the opportunity to do that" retcon.
    As in Norman Osborne wasn't in the same country as when at the time, so they couldn't have done it? Why not. Otherwise, people need to realize that writers rely on the approval of higher powers to pull a radical change, so it's not in a writer's hands to just do it, they need review and approval. Plus, Spider-Man is doing well in the industry at this point, I say this because how you rank says more than the numbers, like nowadays 60K and steady is good numbers for a comic book series.
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