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  1. #61
    Veteran Member Dataweaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeeguy91 View Post
    Forget the New 52 Firestorm series ever happened. I would rather pick up on that whole dynamic Ronnie and Jason had during Brightest Day. To me, it was more interesting than what came out of the New 52 series.
    I know that's your go-to answer for all things New 52; but that's not what Rebirth is doing. Not even Superman and Wonder Woman have ignored the New 52; why would Firestorm?

    I do like the notion of bringing things more in line with what Brightest Day had set up for Firestorm; but you don't have to ditch the post-Flashpoint stuff to get there. Start where LoT left off, then play up the idea that the Firestorm matrix is damaged, and that Jason needs to be brought back in to fix it. Or else the universe goes boom.

    Start out with Ronnie and Martin starting to have instability issues, then someone realizing that the earlier instability issues weren't about Jason per se, but rather that the matrix is quark-like: it takes a balance of three to achieve true stability. Replacing Jason with Martin bought some time by resetting the clock; but it was only a temporary fix. To make it permanent, they need to bring Jason back in. Now, how to do it? And so it begins…

    I'd angle this toward a final status quo where all three share the Firestorm matrix, but usually two at a time (all three together produce the Fury, which is powerful but hard to maintain; they rarely bother). As well, any one of the three can be in the driver's seat: when Ronnie is “driving”, you get classic Firestorm; when Jason is “driving”, you get 2000s Firestorm; and when Martin is “driving”, you get 90s Firestorm.
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  2. #62
    Veteran Member Dataweaver's Avatar
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    As for Loraine: LoT#1 said that everyone else involved with the Firestorm matrix was dead, and mused that Ronnie and Jason probably survived because they were paired up. OK; I didn't follow the N52 Firestorm series (I had dropped out of comics when N52 started, and only came back for Multiversity). Was Firehawk identified as Loraine? If so, the above assertion implies that she's dead, which would be a problem. If not, the Firestorm Rebirth storyline could include granting her the Firehawk powers. The Firehawk matrix should be related to, but distinct from, the Firestorm matrix; possibly draw a parallel between quarks (the Firestorm matrix with its three-person balance) and leptons (the Firehawk matrix which only needs and allows one person).
    Rogue wears rouge.
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  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    I know that's your go-to answer for all things New 52; but that's not what Rebirth is doing. Not even Superman and Wonder Woman have ignored the New 52; why would Firestorm?
    And I know you don't like it whenever I do say it, but that's what I want to see. I want to see Ronnie get his old origin back, where he bonds with Stein not Jason for the first time. And them to actually restore what was probably one of the more unique characters in the DCU. And I know people might disagree, but I do want to revisit the fact that Ronnie, as a Black Lantern, killed Gehenna. It all kinda got swept under the rug after Deathstorm showed up.

    And actually what we have seen of Rebirth, especially now, is that they don't have qualms throwing out New 52 stuff. Even before Reborn (though we still have to see how that shakes out, I guess), we had series like Deathstroke basically putting characters' Pre-Flashpoint history back even in the face of directly contradictory New 52 continuity. And since Blackest Night is already still in continuity, I see no problem simply working Firestorm's part in that event back into canon, especially since a bunch of other characters literally started out the New 52 addressing threads carried over from Blackest Night/Brightest Day (Swamp Thing, Deadman/Dove, etc.). So, I don't see the big deal of restoring at least some of Firestorm's Pre-Flashpoint history as well.

    Not saying I'll get it. I'm just saying that's what I want to see.
    Last edited by Zeeguy91; 03-23-2017 at 06:47 AM.
    Favorite Mythologies: Green Lantern, Batman (pre-Flashpoint), Spider-Man, The Fantastic Four, the Justice League/JLA (pre-Flashpoint)

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    Non-Big Two Pulls - Saga; Archie

  4. #64
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    52 Firestorm became a blotched mess at the Issue 0 reset when they 'reset' the status up to Nuclear Man and not Men. They should have kept Jason and Ronnie separate, that worked (even if the Fury concept was a Lil out there).

    If they wanted them to have that classic partner dynamic, pair Jason with his old best friend and classmate that wasn't introduced in the 52 yet (can't remember his name, but he was an Asian guy that got dissolved in the Matrix in the original universe) or bring in Gehenna. Throw Ronnie back with the Professor.

    All I know is, from the way this franchise treated Jason, they will never get any more of my money ever again until they do this character justice. And it's been like an intentional character assassination since Blackest Night.
    Last edited by Blanks; 03-23-2017 at 09:32 AM.

  5. #65
    Elder Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dataweaver View Post
    As for Loraine: LoT#1 said that everyone else involved with the Firestorm matrix was dead, and mused that Ronnie and Jason probably survived because they were paired up. OK; I didn't follow the N52 Firestorm series (I had dropped out of comics when N52 started, and only came back for Multiversity). Was Firehawk identified as Loraine? If so, the above assertion implies that she's dead, which would be a problem. If not, the Firestorm Rebirth storyline could include granting her the Firehawk powers. The Firehawk matrix should be related to, but distinct from, the Firestorm matrix; possibly draw a parallel between quarks (the Firestorm matrix with its three-person balance) and leptons (the Firehawk matrix which only needs and allows one person).
    I'm not sure about Lorraine since I didnt read the New52 series past the first issue or two, but even if she is supposed to be dead, that's easy enough to get around. Perhaps she wasn't dead but just stuck in the Matrix, or perhaps the Matrix reconstitutes her body (which opens up some interesting plots about whether she's "real" or not) or maybe she never actually died and it was just assumed (did we ever see her body?)
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