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  1. #16
    Mad scientist Carabas's Avatar
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    It's still Star Trek.

    They're going to treat this like a first contact situation and try diplomacy first, especially if they get briefed by Ripley who tells them how intelligent they are.
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

  2. #17
    Veteran Member T51R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post

    Bonus: using standard equipment, how do casts of the other shows fare?
    I get this really disturbing mental picture of a Facehugger trying to impregnate Seven of Nine, only for things to backfire horribly when her nanoprobes break down the embryo and infect the Facehugger...

    ...resulting in the abomination called the BORGHUGGER!

  3. #18
    Veteran Member The Drunkard Kid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T51R View Post
    I get this really disturbing mental picture of a Facehugger trying to impregnate Seven of Nine, only for things to backfire horribly when her nanoprobes break down the embryo and infect the Facehugger...

    ...resulting in the abomination called the BORGHUGGER!
    ?

  4. #19
    Everyone's favorite host Guy Smiley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    So, let's say that somehow, someway, Kirk and Co. find themselves on LV-426 during the events of Aliens (1986). The crew encounters a distress signal and, due to plot interference, their transporters don't work. Kirk orders a shuttlecraft down to the colony to investigate. Later, they find that the atmosphere is also interfering with their communicators -- they can talk to each other, but not the Enterprise, at least not without a more powerful radio. In essence, they've replaced Ripley, Burke, and the Marines.

    The landing party consists of the senior staff: Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Scotty, Sulu, Uhura, Chekov. They have their phasers, tricorders, communicators, and standard equipment (i.e. McCoy with his medicine bag, Scotty with his toolkit, etc).

    From here on out, the rest of the movie plays out normally, including the power plant. Can our heroes find (but not rescue!) the colonists, defeat the Queen, and return to the Enterprise? Each round is a separate scenario, and the first time the crew meets the Xenomorphs.

    Round 1: The crew circa Season 3 of TOS

    Round 2: The crew (with Chekov and Spock) circa The Wrath of Khan (with bonus James Horner score)

    Round 3: The NuTrek crew after the events of Beyond

    Bonus: using standard equipment, how do casts of the other shows fare?
    So, there is a severe problem here. One that almost certainly spells the doom of the entire crew.

    There are no red shirts on this mission. They are all still on board the Enterprise.

    Not only does this mean there's no one to conveniently die instead of a main character when needed on the planet, it means that something is going to go horribly wrong on the Enterprise in order to kill the necessary quota of red shirts. My guess is due to lack of contact with the senior staff, some idiot further down the chain assumed temporary command of the ship and ordered samples beamed up for scientific analysis in support of the mission, and now they've got facehuggers running rampant up there.

    Within half an hour, I expect someone in engineering detonates the warp core in an effort to kill all the xenomorphs running around, while the saucer section separates, turns out to have xenomorphs, and crashes somewhere in one of the polar regions of the planet. Kirk and crew, even if they survive and succeed up to the usual extraction point, cannot get back off-planet, and only Kirk's seduction of the Alien Queen (after his bare-knuckle brawl with one of her drones) prevents them from all being eaten.

  5. #20
    Veteran Member Cyke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalak View Post
    So thus they are going to be fully kitted out for battle when going down and losing contact with the Enterprise? Kirk won't mess around with deadly aliens as he has hunted down at least one Ahab-style, so beyond the standard weapons I see them maybe bringing down some high explosives or the ingredients and equipment to make some fun chemical toys that Bones & Spock could come up with to screw with things that have Acid for blood.

    If they are still stuck with the standard loadout and just supplied with Info I think they are fucked as they might know better how to respond but not have the extra energy packs and such to make a winning fight out of it. They could rig a few things from the wrecked colony but like a fallen Captain in an episode of TOS I can't remember the name of said "But they just kept coming!"
    Yeah, I purposely didn't put in things like phaser rifles and photon grenades simply because their limits had never been really shown (outside of illusions, of course), and they were seldom used. Of course, I'm sure they'd want that equipment eventually.

    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    If Ripley actually gets them to buy into the concept of the Xenomorph, I have a tough time buying that the usual "Away Mission" sort of scenario happens.
    But the Plot Prophets here demand it. I am merely their Emissary. Corporeal matters do not concern them. But mortal challenge does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Smiley View Post
    So, there is a severe problem here. One that almost certainly spells the doom of the entire crew.

    There are no red shirts on this mission. They are all still on board the Enterprise.

    Not only does this mean there's no one to conveniently die instead of a main character when needed on the planet, it means that something is going to go horribly wrong on the Enterprise in order to kill the necessary quota of red shirts. My guess is due to lack of contact with the senior staff, some idiot further down the chain assumed temporary command of the ship and ordered samples beamed up for scientific analysis in support of the mission, and now they've got facehuggers running rampant up there.

    Within half an hour, I expect someone in engineering detonates the warp core in an effort to kill all the xenomorphs running around, while the saucer section separates, turns out to have xenomorphs, and crashes somewhere in one of the polar regions of the planet. Kirk and crew, even if they survive and succeed up to the usual extraction point, cannot get back off-planet, and only Kirk's seduction of the Alien Queen (after his bare-knuckle brawl with one of her drones) prevents them from all being eaten.
    I'll allow it.
    "Until the lion learns to write, every story will glorify the hunter."
    --African proverb

  6. #21
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Yeah, I purposely didn't put in things like phaser rifles and photon grenades simply because their limits had never been really shown (outside of illusions, of course), and they were seldom used. Of course, I'm sure they'd want that equipment eventually.
    Those are TNG inventions yes? I was just talking about the standard explosive charges they are sure to have by that level of technology, hell extra phasers to overload on a whim could do it. I'm sure no one would think to have a torpedo beamed down with them even in a best-case scenario.

    But no Red Shirts and no Extra Gear make the Away Team something something in this case.

  7. #22
    Junior Member Dr Quinch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Powerboy View Post
    As to the movie, don't think I saw that one. I saw the original 1979 one and some more recent ones.
    Stop whatever you are doing and go and watch Aliens immediately. That is all.
    "You can't ask a fantasy author not to want a knighthood. For two pins I'd have a sword and a horse."
    - Sir Terry Pratchett explaining his decision to accept ennoblement.

  8. #23
    Veteran Member Cyke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalak View Post
    Those are TNG inventions yes? I was just talking about the standard explosive charges they are sure to have by that level of technology, hell extra phasers to overload on a whim could do it.
    Kirk's era had grenades and rifles:
    Starfleet issue grenade and launcher: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/G...er%2C_2267.jpg
    TOS Phaser rifle: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/T...aser_rifle.jpg

    The thing is, they're both really lacking in feats to define them. At the very least, we'd expect the phaser rifle to be as powerful and versatile as a regular phaser, but beyond that, it's used to show how tough an enemy is when the beam just splashes off them.

    A photon grenade was detonated 1200 yards away from an enemy camp for the purpose of driving them away from that camp rather than to harm or kill. Even then, Kirk said it was cutting it close. So there's at least that. Presumably the grenade, like everything else in Starfleet, has settings and variable yields, but nothing to really prove that.

    But no Red Shirts and no Extra Gear make the Away Team something something in this case.
    Yep. No red shirts to test the waters for them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Quinch View Post
    Stop whatever you are doing and go and watch Aliens immediately. That is all.
    Seconded, naturally.
    Last edited by Cyke; 03-17-2017 at 11:38 AM.
    "Until the lion learns to write, every story will glorify the hunter."
    --African proverb

  9. #24
    Senior Member abmccray's Avatar
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    Also remember on watching Aliens for the first time that all of the tropes you feel may be passe' in Aliens...were basically invented/popularized by Aliens. It's only "normal" now because everything stole from it - at the time, it was really like nothing else we saw.

  10. #25
    Mad scientist Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Yep. No red shirts to test the waters for them.
    Technically, Scotty and Uhura are redshirts.
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

  11. #26
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Kirk's era had grenades and rifles:
    Starfleet issue grenade and launcher: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/G...er%2C_2267.jpg
    TOS Phaser rifle: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/T...aser_rifle.jpg

    The thing is, they're both really lacking in feats to define them. At the very least, we'd expect the phaser rifle to be as powerful and versatile as a regular phaser, but beyond that, it's used to show how tough an enemy is when the beam just splashes off them.

    A photon grenade was detonated 1200 yards away from an enemy camp for the purpose of driving them away from that camp rather than to harm or kill. Even then, Kirk said it was cutting it close. So there's at least that. Presumably the grenade, like everything else in Starfleet, has settings and variable yields, but nothing to really prove that.
    Well, you learn something new every day.

    Yep. No red shirts to test the waters for them.
    Or provide occasional spare power packs and Phasers when they inevitably die



    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Technically, Scotty and Uhura are redshirts.
    They are as much Red Shirts as Data is a Gold Shirt. The colors you wear only matter if you don't have character shields or even a name, though a name alone is no assurance there.

  12. #27
    E-Liter3K Scoped Headshot The MunchKING's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Smiley View Post
    Within half an hour, I expect someone in engineering detonates the warp core in an effort to kill all the xenomorphs running around, while the saucer section separates, turns out to have xenomorphs, and crashes somewhere in one of the polar regions of the planet. Kirk and crew, even if they survive and succeed up to the usual extraction point, cannot get back off-planet, and only Kirk's seduction of the Alien Queen (after his bare-knuckle brawl with one of her drones) prevents them from all being eaten.
    Kirk-era Enterprise couldn't saucer-separate, could it?
    The MunchKING is Back! And he is AWSOME!

  13. #28
    Mad scientist Carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The MunchKING View Post
    Kirk-era Enterprise couldn't saucer-separate, could it?
    Not on purpose at least.
    So this Zealot comes to my door, all glazed eyes and clean reproductive organs, asking me if I ever think about God. So I tell him I killed God. I tracked God down like a rabid dog, hacked off his legs with a hedge trimmer, and boiled off his corpse in an acid bath. So he pulls an alternating-current taser on me and tells me that only the Official Serbian Church of Tesla can save my polyphase intrinsic electric field, known to non-engineers as "the soul". So I hit him. What would you do?

  14. #29
    Postin' since Aug '05 Dalak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Not on purpose at least.
    TNG-Era Future Scotty told TOS Scotty how the Enterprise D was able to do it that one time he got so drunk on alien booze be caused a temporal anomaly.

  15. #30
    Veteran Member Powerboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by abmccray View Post
    Also remember on watching Aliens for the first time that all of the tropes you feel may be passe' in Aliens...were basically invented/popularized by Aliens. It's only "normal" now because everything stole from it - at the time, it was really like nothing else we saw.
    Definitely. When I was reading a review of the LoTR movies, some idiot criticized them on the grounds that some of the stuff the characters say is cliche. But they are cliche now because Tolkien came up with them and they've been copied for decades.

    Although I do think this thing of accusing things of having "tropes" has itself become a trope. By definition, everything in a story is a trope. Even a new way of presenting it is still just a new way of presenting a trope.
    The Four Levels of Competence
    Unconscious incompetence - where one is not aware one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious incompetence - where one has trained enough to finally figured out one stinks and has zero skill.
    Conscious competence - where one has skill, but needs to concentrate and think about everything as one is doing it.
    Unconscious competence - where one has hardwired stuff in enough that one doesn't actually think about what one is doing, but just does it.
    -SharpandPointies

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