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  1. #46
    Fantastic Member enish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BiteTheBullet View Post
    All I am talking about is Diana being able to toss a being in the air that should weigh no more than the tank she threw in the trailer. Just because Doomsday is growing stronger doesn't mean that Diana should not be able to lift him with relative ease.

    Also, since Diana has strength that is supposed to be on par with Superman, wouldn't that be a display of strength for Doomsday to knock or toss either of them around? I mean, it is the same argument, right? She is sparring with someone, who may be stronger, but then again she is also supposed to be very strong and is living and breathing like Doomsday.

    Given that a tank is incredibly durable and tough, I would certainly say one of it's superpowers is toughness. Plus the ability to spew artillery at objects from a great distance away is another superpower. I guess anyone could play with sarcasm if they didn't really think about what the other poster said for more than a second.
    Look at the scene and compare it to how Superman was able to deal with Doomsday. I know that in itself, WW tossing Doomsday should be a normal thing. But, Superman was nowhere able to toss Doomsday around in that part of the battle, was he? My point here was not to dismiss Superman's ability but to prove that Diana is his equal in terms of power, by comparing the limited physical feats that we have.

    Of course you will possibly point out that Superman flew Doomsday away from the place where Diana and Bruce were standing, but Superman was benefiting from the momentum of him flying down from the sky and when WW tossed DD into the air, he had already evolved for a 3d time, so he is "supposedly" heavier and surely tougher and stronger than before. Superman's attacks were not efficient against DD in his 3d evolution, Diana made a difference because she has weapons and fights cleverly, but you must admit that Superman did not toss Doomsday around in that battle thus to me, it is a feat for Diana which is not negligible!

    Now I'm open to be convinced otherwise if someone comes up with another reading and interpretation of the scene, but up to now that is how I have analyzed it.

  2. #47
    Fantastic Member enish's Avatar
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    Animate object vs inanimate objects:

    I'm no mathematician but I think that a 7.75 tonnes tank which does not move is maybe easier to lift and throw than a 2 tonnes Kryptonian monster who moves around, right? Isn't there anything about weight and speed which could make an object heavier than it originally is? Something like that? I'm sorry if I'm not using the right terms.

    But my point will easily be dismissed since in that particular scene when Diana tossed DD into the air, the former was not actually moving.

    Now, Diana knew that Doomsday was feeding on energy, and that must be a reason why she decided not to go all out on him. And I also think the point was to by some time for either Kal or Bruce to find the weapon right? Not actually defeat him with brute strength, since they knew it would not be possible.

    Or maybe we are reading too much into this, but I really want to convince the most skeptical of us that DCEU Diana is no weakling and is Supe's equal, even if we have limited footage to back this up.

  3. #48
    Ultimate Member Vanguard-01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BiteTheBullet View Post
    Apparently many of the people will assume she is Gal's age of 31 in the movie and therefore think she is the naiive to the ways of the world.

    If they had not made her 5000 years old, according to Synder, then the excuse of her only learning her powers would make much more sense. That is, if she was only in her 20's or even is she is 31.
    How do we know she's 5000 from HER perspective? If time moves differently on Themiscyra, then Diana could've lived only 18 or so years from her perspective, while millennia passed in the world outside.

    Quote Originally Posted by username_ View Post
    spoilers:
    She was created to kill Ares specifically, she's not gonna vaporize Steppenwolf with a blast this god killing power now is she. What I'm told is that this power is harmless to most beings but lethal to Ares, just as kryptonite poisons Superman. So you can kiss god mode goodbye
    end of spoilers
    No, she probably won't singlehandedly vaporize Steppenwolf in Justice League. Because it's called "Justice League" not "Wonder Woman Rules All." It's the story of how the League comes together and works together to defeat Steppenwolf.

    And no, God Mode isn't going "goodbye." If Diana can slug it out with Doomsday, she can slug it out with ANYTHING the DCEU puts in front of her.

    Re Doomsday, she was beaten the minute she lost her shield in the rubble, I know that smirk improvised by Gal Gadot tricked you into thinking Wonder Woman was just getting warmed up but now picture the scene without the smirk, as Snyder originally intended it...I'm just reading the scene
    It. Doesn't. MATTER. What Snyder originally intended. He kept the smirk in the scene because he thought it made the scene better and better conveyed that Diana was kicking ass and taking names.

    "Diana was beaten the minute she lost her shield?" Last time I checked, "beaten" people don't smile at their attackers, CUT OFF ONE OF THEIR LIMBS, take a full strike from their most powerful weapon, and get right back up to restrain them seconds later. Diana was completely undamaged and didn't even look tired at the end of that battle.

    She fought Doomsday. She took no visible damage, even after losing the shield. She did damage to him. THAT'S "reading the scene" because THAT'S what actually went down in the movie.
    Though much is taken, much abides; and though
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
    One equal temper of heroic hearts,
    Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
    To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

    --Lord Alfred Tennyson--

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    No, she probably won't singlehandedly vaporize Steppenwolf in Justice League. Because it's called "Justice League" not "Wonder Woman Rules All." It's the story of how the League comes together and works together to defeat Steppenwolf.

    And no, God Mode isn't going "goodbye." If Diana can slug it out with Doomsday, she can slug it out with ANYTHING the DCEU puts in front of her.
    I didn't say Wonder Woman -should- defeat Steppenwolf singlehandedly hey, only that this power Zeus put inside her doesn't make Diana quote unquote "more powerful than fans could ever hope for", quite the opposite in fact

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    It. Doesn't. MATTER. What Snyder originally intended. He kept the smirk in the scene because he thought it made the scene better and better conveyed that Diana was kicking ass and taking names.

    "Diana was beaten the minute she lost her shield?" Last time I checked, "beaten" people don't smile at their attackers, CUT OFF ONE OF THEIR LIMBS, take a full strike from their most powerful weapon, and get right back up to restrain them seconds later. Diana was completely undamaged and didn't even look tired at the end of that battle.

    She fought Doomsday. She took no visible damage, even after losing the shield. She did damage to him. THAT'S "reading the scene" because THAT'S what actually went down in the movie.
    Obviously Snyder didn't realize the smirk would make it seem like Wonder Woman had things under control and that Superman died for nothing, I think keeping the smirk in the scene was really just an error of judgment on his part, he makes a lot of those.
    The shield is what kept Wonder Woman in one piece, I think she would've been mauled to death if Superman hadn't put an end to the proceedings
    And I don't believe Geoff Johns took a look at the spider charts and was like "Zack you gotta up her stats man", did't happen

  5. #50
    Ultimate Member Vanguard-01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by username_ View Post
    I didn't say Wonder Woman -should- defeat Steppenwolf singlehandedly hey, only that this power Zeus put inside her doesn't make Diana quote unquote "more powerful than fans could ever hope for", quite the opposite in fact
    She went toe-to-toe with Doomsday, did damage to him, and took everything he could throw at her. That already makes her more powerful than we could hope for.

    Why? Because NO version of Diana has EVER done that well against Doomsday. Literally. None. In the comics, Diana tends to get her ass kicked by Doomsday, when she ever gets the chance to fight him at all.

    Obviously Snyder didn't realize the smirk would make it seem like Wonder Woman had things under control and that Superman died for nothing, I think keeping the smirk in the scene was really just an error of judgment on his part, he makes a lot of those.
    You are literally the ONLY person I've ever seen question the meaning of that smirk. Even from people who hated just about everything else about the movie. Seems to me like if there's an "error in judgement' here, it's probably yours.

    The shield is what kept Wonder Woman in one piece, I think she would've been mauled to death if Superman hadn't put an end to the proceedings
    Prove it. Because I can prove that Diana took a full strike from Doomsday's heat vision WITHOUT THE SHIELD and she was just fine.

    And I don't believe Geoff Johns took a look at the spider charts and was like "Zack you gotta up her stats man", did't happen
    Prove it again.

    Johns knew this was Diana's debut in the big screen. He knew that Marvel had been lagging behind in the female representation department. It's kind of ridiculously easy to imagine he wanted the first major female superhero to have a truly epic first showing.
    Though much is taken, much abides; and though
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
    One equal temper of heroic hearts,
    Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
    To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

    --Lord Alfred Tennyson--

  6. #51
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    How do we know she's 5000 from HER perspective? If time moves differently on Themiscyra, then Diana could've lived only 18 or so years from her perspective, while millennia passed in the world outside.
    I'm thinking context. Unless she has no clue.

  7. #52
    Ultimate Member Vanguard-01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by numberthirty View Post
    I'm thinking context. Unless she has no clue.
    What context would she have? She was conceived and/or born upon the creation of Themiscyra. Odds are she has no memory of Man's World, so she'd have no idea what it looked like the last time she was in it.
    Though much is taken, much abides; and though
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
    One equal temper of heroic hearts,
    Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
    To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

    --Lord Alfred Tennyson--

  8. #53
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    And this one would've met the same fate without her lifesaving shield. Doomsday would've crushed every bone in her body like he's always done in the comics and would've proceeded to do in this scene had it not been for Superman's sacrifice. Shot yourself in the foot there Vanguard-01

    So not only isn't Wonder Woman "more powerful than we could ever hope for", she doesn't fly (presumably) and struggles with a hand cranked gatling gun. At face value, she seems less powerful to me

    PS- Heat Vision's never been a problem for her
    Last edited by username_; 03-21-2017 at 09:44 PM.

  9. #54
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    What context would she have? She was conceived and/or born upon the creation of Themiscyra. Odds are she has no memory of Man's World, so she'd have no idea what it looked like the last time she was in it.
    Is the man's world she will step into something that will make sense as just having sprung up fully formed?

    If her perspective on the island is "This is a year", what reason do we have to buy into that said perception would not automatically equal time moving faster outside of it? Has her perspective changed markedly in some clip you have seen?

  10. #55
    U Got Me Str8 Trippin Boo nj06's Avatar
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    I haven't read thru this entire thread, but I hope that Wonder Woman still has the ability to communicate with animals. I know its far from her greatest ability, but I always thought it was cool. I like that Diana has a connection to nature and would like to see her use that ability in the movies.
    We are the Dora Milaje. We are the daughters of the 18 tribes of Wakanda. We are the teeth of the Panther God. Out of 10,000 years of sweat and bloodshed and battle are we born. We are the women of this ancient land. Deadliest of the species. And our time has come!

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