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  1. #31
    Astonishing Member Last Son of Krypton's Avatar
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    The Flashpoint world could be the one shown in the Knightmare sequence.
    Last edited by Last Son of Krypton; 08-07-2017 at 02:24 PM.

  2. #32
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    Or in this timeline, Diana actually accepted Ares's offer to team up against humanity.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    It's essentially a glorified "what if" scenario. If the movie makes that clear enough (and gives her a plausible enough reason to end up that way),
    Even as a "what if," it needs to be enjoyable. Watching my favorite characters dragged through the dirt for the glory of another isn't fun. As a WW fan, Flashpoint sucked.

    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    ...(especially since things will be reset by the end of the film anyway).
    "This movie undoes itself." As a paying customer, that's even more reason not to see it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    Also if it gives me a Diana vs. Mera fight then YES PLEASE!!
    This could be interesting IF, as you said, they're actually well written this time around.

    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher007 View Post
    Or in this timeline, Diana actually accepted Ares's offer to team up against humanity.
    Maybe if she sees Steve killed by another human before he can save the day, then she might lose faith in the worth of humanity? I don't know, I'm still not sold.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    Well, when time travel is involved, you absolutely can unring a bell. You can prevent that bell from ever having been rung in the first place. If Flashpoint Diana does bad things, but the movie ends with all of that being wiped out, then it's all a wash.
    Continuity technicalities don't erase my memory. As a fan, I still know the Flashpoint story. And, as a WW fan, it stinks. So, I don't care if it technically doesn't count, I care if it's enjoyable to me. I seriously doubt that many of the new WW fans, many of whom are not the general comic movie fans, are not going to be excited to pay to see a rabid, idiotic WW murdering her way through Europe just so Flash can have his movie.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    Memes get made no matter the context.
    True. But it tends to be best to not give them easy material.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    It probably will be Flashpoint in name only, which is why I'm not too worried about it. Heck, as I said earlier, they may even flip the script and let Diana remain heroic this time. But I seriously doubt we'll be watching Diana killing kids and I very much doubt we'll see her killing Steve. Now THAT would probably be a bridge too far.
    True, it could be a very different version of Flashpoint. But killing Steve is the bridge too far? Worse than murdering kids?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    I'm pretty sure they're only considering a Flashpoint movie as a plan to tweak the DCEU in order to deal with some of the issues people have with it. If so? Then Diana couldn't be safer. NO ONE can be stupid enough to think that Diana needs any tweaking at all.
    Oh, many in Hollywood, including WB, execs have made stupid decisions. So, I never count on anything as being too stupid.

  5. #35
    Ultimate Member Vanguard-01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awonder View Post
    Continuity technicalities don't erase my memory. As a fan, I still know the Flashpoint story. And, as a WW fan, it stinks. So, I don't care if it technically doesn't count, I care if it's enjoyable to me. I seriously doubt that many of the new WW fans, many of whom are not the general comic movie fans, are not going to be excited to pay to see a rabid, idiotic WW murdering her way through Europe just so Flash can have his movie.
    I think you're seriously underestimating people's ability to interpret a story and understand how they work. Unless Flashpoint's entire story--I'm talking from trailers to the way the movie itself unfolds in the theaters--is presented like this really IS just the new status quo of the DCEU, people will be able to understand that it's a "time has been messed with" kind of story. If, as rumored, Robert Zemeckis directs the movie, this will be even more prominent in people's minds. The guy who did Back to the Freaking Future? Yeaaah.

    People can, and will, watch this movie and recognize that this is not a good thing. That Flash seriously screwed up, and now the world suffers for it. Decades of time-travel movies and TV shows, however, have taught most people to understand that time travel shenanigans can be set right. That's what they'll hope for and that's what they'll get. So, they will definitely understand that this isn't the Diana they've known and loved and they'll be mad at Barry (and rightly so) for messing her up. When he finally sets everything right? All's well that ends well.

    True, it could be a very different version of Flashpoint. But killing Steve is the bridge too far? Worse than murdering kids?
    Diana killing Steve after the audience fell in love with the two of them together would probably feel more like a personal loss for the audience. Diana killing kids will be awful. Her killing the man she loved, negating his sacrifice in her movie? On a raw, emotional level, that one will probably hit Diana's fans harder.

    Either way, it'd be a risk.
    Though much is taken, much abides; and though
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are,
    One equal temper of heroic hearts,
    Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
    To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

    --Lord Alfred Tennyson--

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    I think you're seriously underestimating people's ability to interpret a story and understand how they work. Unless Flashpoint's entire story--I'm talking from trailers to the way the movie itself unfolds in the theaters--is presented like this really IS just the new status quo of the DCEU, people will be able to understand that it's a "time has been messed with" kind of story. If, as rumored, Robert Zemeckis directs the movie, this will be even more prominent in people's minds. The guy who did Back to the Freaking Future? Yeaaah.

    People can, and will, watch this movie and recognize that this is not a good thing. That Flash seriously screwed up, and now the world suffers for it. Decades of time-travel movies and TV shows, however, have taught most people to understand that time travel shenanigans can be set right. That's what they'll hope for and that's what they'll get. So, they will definitely understand that this isn't the Diana they've known and loved and they'll be mad at Barry (and rightly so) for messing her up. When he finally sets everything right? All's well that ends well.
    No, I'm not underestimating the viewing audience's ability to understand that the timeline has been messed up. I'm saying you still need to make it enjoyable for them or there's no reason for them to go see the movie. As a WW fan, I don't care as much about Flash, so I don't care if he gets to fix his mistake. Many WW movie fans are not going to go see WW behaving badly just to make the Flash movie look more important.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    Diana killing Steve after the audience fell in love with the two of them together would probably feel more like a personal loss for the audience. Diana killing kids will be awful. Her killing the man she loved, negating his sacrifice in her movie? On a raw, emotional level, that one will probably hit Diana's fans harder.
    True, it would be more personal, but not worse than murdering kids.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vanguard-01 View Post
    Either way, it'd be a risk.
    Therein lies the problem: is the gamble worth the risk? Why risk alienating new fans of a movie that brought a lot of positive attention (and $$$) for the spectacle of another, yet unproven, character?

    I totally get that movie Flashpoint can, and likely will, be very different than the original story. But, going on what we have, I still don't really see it as the right story at the right time. As a WW fan, a bad portrayal of WW, no matter that I understand it doesn't technically count, will keep from giving them my money to see it. That's the risk they are taking.
    Last edited by Awonder; 08-07-2017 at 04:31 PM.

  7. #37
    Incredible Member NYCER's Avatar
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    Regular, non-comic reading moviegoers really don't know who's who in these superhero films. When I came out of BvS last year, someone said, "Who was that lady at the end? Was that Superwoman?"

    Many of those who patronized Patty Jenkins's film were aware of Lynda Carter's version and are now acquainted with Gal Gadot's.

    It'd be franchise suicide to depict Diana as the monster Geoff Johns wrote in FLASHPOINT onscreen.

  8. #38
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    I wonder if the objective is to keep Gal Gadot so busy working on DC movies that she doesn't have time to do any other projects--thus escaping the Cavill-moustache drama. This way Gadot would never have time to grow a moustache.

    My baby loves love--my baby loves lovin'
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYCER View Post
    Regular, non-comic reading moviegoers really don't know who's who in these superhero films. When I came out of BvS last year, someone said, "Who was that lady at the end? Was that Superwoman?"

    Many of those who patronized Patty Jenkins's film were aware of Lynda Carter's version and are now acquainted with Gal Gadot's.

    It'd be franchise suicide to depict Diana as the monster Geoff Johns wrote in FLASHPOINT onscreen.
    Not the same thing at all:

    -That was the first time that WW appeared in a live action big movie, ever. That's not the case now.

    -Irrelevant.

    You're severally underestimated the audience's intelligence (which Hollywood unfortunately tends to do as well). The notion that they cannot go "oh Flash screwed with the timeline, and so it changed things" is not going to be hard for them to buy. And they've bought it in other films as well.

    So, no. It would in no way whatsoever be "franchise suicide" to do Flashpoint Diana, simple as that.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awonder View Post
    No, I'm not underestimating the viewing audience's ability to understand that the timeline has been messed up. I'm saying you still need to make it enjoyable for them or there's no reason for them to go see the movie. As a WW fan, I don't care as much about Flash, so I don't care if he gets to fix his mistake. Many WW movie fans are not going to go see WW behaving badly just to make the Flash movie look more important.



    True, it would be more personal, but not worse than murdering kids.



    Therein lies the problem: is the gamble worth the risk? Why risk alienating new fans of a movie that brought a lot of positive attention (and $$$) for the spectacle of another, yet unproven, character?

    I totally get that movie Flashpoint can, and likely will, be very different than the original story. But, going on what we have, I still don't really see it as the right story at the right time. As a WW fan, a bad portrayal of WW, no matter that I understand it doesn't technically count, will keep from giving them my money to see it. That's the risk they are taking.
    Then don't go see a FLASH MOVIE!! He's going to be the focus. There problem solved, and hey you can just skip evil Diana by doing that to.

  11. #41
    Astonishing Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    If the general audience can follow Days of Future Past, they should be able to follow this.

    I'm far more concerned about Superman. At least Gadot would have a more fun role.

  12. #42
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    It doesn't speak well of a movie when the best defence for it is that it's ultimately something you can ignore and you don't need to see it. That's not a great marketing strategy for a WB tentpole.

    While I believe the Flashpoint concept has the potential to be very good, it also has a lot of potential to be a hot mess.

    My baby loves love--my baby loves lovin'
    She's got what it takes and she knows how to use it

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  13. #43
    Incredible Member NYCER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Kelly View Post
    It doesn't speak well of a movie when the best defence for it is that it's ultimately something you can ignore and you don't need to see it. That's not a great marketing strategy for a WB tentpole.

    While I believe the Flashpoint concept has the potential to be very good, it also has a lot of potential to be a hot mess.
    The hot mess scenario is much more likely to occur than the "lot of potential" one.

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